Starting Issue (bad ground) - Maintenance and Repair Forum

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Starting Issue (bad ground)
Sunday, October 10, 2010 2:16 PM
I have a 2004 Cavalier with about 68k on it. I relocated my battery to the trunk in 2006 and added some car stereo equipment. The car ran great for the past few years...until recently.

Here's what's going on. The other night I got in my car and tried to start it...all I got was a series of clicks and once in a while about half a turn on the motor. I decided to have my wife turn the key while I messed with the ground cable and it eventually started. All of the connections have been cleaned on the possitive and negative sides. My ground point is on the metal car body behind the carpet in the trunk (it was sanded and cleaned so there is no paint). The battery is about a year old. Any thoughts guys?

Thanks,
-Jordan

Re: Starting Issue (bad ground)
Sunday, October 10, 2010 3:10 PM
Just a quick update. I was out fiddling with the car a bit more and got the car to start. It's really odd and somewhat random. When I turn the key the car will continuously click. If I then turn the car off then back on several times...the car will turn over. Once I got the car started...I took if for a few minute drive around the neighborhood and then back home. I turned the car back off then on (expecting it to be charged and start easily)...no such luck. It was right back to clicking at me, then starting after repeating this for a while. Once I started it a second time...I again took it for a little drive. This time I noticed some subtle clicking from behind the dash (at higher rmps) and the rpms were slightly elevated than normal at an idle.

Now I have pulled the battery and stuck it on a charger. The charger is reading just under 7 volts. Could a bad ground cause the battery to lose power or could the battery already be shorted out? What about a possible dead cell? How will I know if this is the case?

Please let me know what you guys think.

Thanks,
Jordan
Re: Starting Issue (bad ground)
Sunday, October 10, 2010 5:41 PM
Yet another update. I left the battery on the charger, then left to run to do some things and grab dinner...came back and the charger said that the batter was charged. I unhooked the battery from the charger and stuck it back in the car. The car is still doing the same thing...minus most of the clicking. Now it begins to turn over then stops or just turns so slowely that the car can't start. After a while it will eventually turn over, then the rpms shoot to about 3k and slowely drop down to the normal 800-900 rpms. The gauges are also hopping all over the place. I took it on another short drive and when I rolled to a stop sign...I pushed the clutch in and the rpms again shot to 3k and stayed there until I turned the car off. once the car was off...I had to go through the restarting ritual again. What is going on with this thing??? I don't really have the cash at the moment to take it to the garage. can someone please try to shed some light on this???

Thanks,
-Jordan
Re: Starting Issue (bad ground)
Monday, October 11, 2010 3:54 AM
One more thing I noticed is that an "error" appears on my odometer for a short while afer the car finally starts (about 10-20 seconds). This message is displayed while my guages are flicking around on the dash. Could I be getting a surge from somewhere?
Re: Starting Issue (bad ground)
Monday, October 11, 2010 6:50 AM
I feel like I'm talking to my self here! *Hint Hint*

After speaking with someone here at work, the mentioned the alternator may actually be overcharging. After reading the below link...I may have to agree with them. I will be testing that asap.

Alternator Problems
Re: Starting Issue (bad ground)
Monday, October 11, 2010 8:36 AM
You know you mite have a problem on the pos. side it don't have to be on the ground . and you should get the battery tested to if it is shorted .
Re: Starting Issue (bad ground)
Monday, October 11, 2010 10:36 AM
Tech97 wrote:You know you mite have a problem on the pos. side it don't have to be on the ground . and you should get the battery tested to if it is shorted .


I disconnected, checked, and cleaned all possitive connections as well. I'm going to have both, the alternator and battery tested either tonight or tomorrow.
Re: Starting Issue (bad ground)
Monday, October 11, 2010 3:04 PM
I just got home and popped the covers off of the batter fill holes. The fluid was an inch or more low with the coils being exposed. I added distilled water until the coils were completely covered, then the car fired right up and ran normally. I will take it for a longer test drive in a bit, but this may have done the trick? Next question...what caused the fluid level to go down?
Re: Starting Issue (bad ground)
Monday, October 11, 2010 4:22 PM
Overcharging (either alternator or a standalone battery charger) can cause the fluid to leak right out of the top of the battery. Seen it happen a few times when people leave the charger on "start" instead of trickle/slow charge.
Lights doing weird **** on the gauges can be from low voltage. I've had my alternator die a couple of times, and the lights always start doing funny stuff.
You should be getting around 14.7 volts at idle with the engine running..... if you're not, something isn't right.
With you having moved your battery AND having audio equipment.... I'd check whatever fuses (I HOPE you used fuses!?) are inline from your alt to the battery to the starter etc. Including the stock fusible link coming off the alt going to the starter. One of them could be on the brink of failing and is heating up.
Re: Starting Issue (bad ground)
Monday, October 11, 2010 7:38 PM
Richard K wrote:Overcharging (either alternator or a standalone battery charger) can cause the fluid to leak right out of the top of the battery. Seen it happen a few times when people leave the charger on "start" instead of trickle/slow charge.
Lights doing weird **** on the gauges can be from low voltage. I've had my alternator die a couple of times, and the lights always start doing funny stuff.
You should be getting around 14.7 volts at idle with the engine running..... if you're not, something isn't right.
With you having moved your battery AND having audio equipment.... I'd check whatever fuses (I HOPE you used fuses!?) are inline from your alt to the battery to the starter etc. Including the stock fusible link coming off the alt going to the starter. One of them could be on the brink of failing and is heating up.



I removed the stereo system until I figure out what's going on, so all in-line fuses have been checked. I am definitely leaning towards the alternator overcharging the battery. This battery hasn't seen a charger for more than 2 or 3 hours. After I added water to the cells (it started great) I took it for a longer (15-20 minute) drive, then turned it off...restarted it and it was acting up again. I'll test the alternator tomorrow and see what i find out. It should be at 14.7 volts @ idle you say? Thanks!
Re: Starting Issue (bad ground)
Tuesday, October 12, 2010 8:43 AM
Close to, if you take it to advance auto parts (assuming you live near one), and find someone that knows how to use the ****ing tool they have, they can tell you if you have any drains, how much voltage you're getting, cranking amps etc.

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