LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion - Page 2 - Performance Forum

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Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Wednesday, October 11, 2006 8:34 AM
This is funny stuff right here... Never imagined this ol thread would be dusted off and brought back up. I can repost the wiring instructions when I get home. I ended up using the DIS2 with MSD wires and Stock 2.2L coils w/ the MSD coil adaptors. I am actually selling this setup if anyone is interested. I am selling the car and need to revert as much back to factory as possible. This setup was great for 13.8 passes on a 70 shot. I had my zex box hooked up to it and it would automatically bring the nitrous on w/ the programed retard at 3,000 RPM and shut it off at 6,000 RPM (Safety concern) through each gear. I loved it. Much easier to run compression test and diagnose other probs when you don't have the ID Cover on the engine.

<img src="http://registry.gmenthusiast.com/images/sinistercav/turbo24sol.gif">

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Wednesday, October 11, 2006 10:59 AM
yah, if you could repost the wriing instructions that would be great... did you have to use the MSD DIS-2 or could I just wire some coils in of another GM and then just run some plug wires??? what years would I be looking for to pick up the parts?

Ian, it's cools man I knew you had plans but I didn't expect to make it either. I got to see some good ruins and I will put up a video or 2


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Wednesday, October 11, 2006 11:47 AM
I have been thinking about doing the same thing, just never got around to it. Here is a wiring diagram that someone posted last year sometime






Jason
99 Z24
157hp/171tq
wheres my boost??
Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Wednesday, October 11, 2006 11:49 AM
I am wanting to go to GM and pick up some coils... do I need the DIS-2??? I thought I Saw a post that said you could simply just rewire it to make it work from stock wiring. I would like to head out today and pick up the stuff and have it in tonight


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Wednesday, October 11, 2006 4:51 PM
looks like I need 2200 98+ ICM, so I need to get that tonight should be a good time.


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Wednesday, October 11, 2006 6:24 PM
Def interested. Is there going to be an actual step-by-step write up to go along with the pictures? Also, can I keep the same spark plugs (Delco Platinums) or do I have to change to a different temperature? If possible, can someone e-mail me the directions, and make them idiot-proof please? atroxaranea@hotmail.com

Thanks!

Sam


Ban low-performance cars, not high-performance ones.
Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Wednesday, October 11, 2006 7:10 PM
The diagram above is for the MSD setup and doesn't show which of the trigger wires are the 1/4 and 2/3 triggers.
The wires are colored with one black and two whites if I remember correctly coming off of the ICM to the factory, under IDI coils.

If anyone is interested in what I'd done and want the complete writeup on it, with pics, here is the link to it.
With the information there, you can pretty much use the MSD #8870 coil bracket along with the MSD#8224 coil pack.
This is the combination of the two part numbers of the above.

It's then just a matter of getting your trigger wires (two white and one black, the black being the return wire) from the ICM to trigger the coils to make them work with spark plug wires to the plugs.

Hope this helps.

Misnblu




Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!





Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Wednesday, October 11, 2006 9:30 PM
I grabbed the 2001 2.2 ICM and coils... super easy to install... or it appears to be, just rewire the 8 wires... should be a quick job.


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 6:28 AM
Just make sure you bypass the ICM somehow if you plan on using the complete assembly for the coil packs..
Remember that the coils sit on top of the ICM and are internally connected to the ICM with the mounts.
If you don't gut the ICM (unless you plan on using it as the new ICM for your setup), will have to gut it, and rewire it internally..
Anyway, good luck with it and keep us posted on how it works out for you. I'm curious to know.

Misnblu




Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!





Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 8:22 AM
as far as something eco specific I have some instructions on my site, not for the full coil conversion but some helpful info of what wires to tap



1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85





Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 9:22 AM
I am going to use the 2.2 ICM... it is only 8 wires so I will redo that. I got a couple more emails says that the coils may not be my issue, it is a 50/50 thing either coils or ICM, but the 2.2 one apparently fixes that... so if it does I may have to redo it all with MSD, but this is to see if something changes... good or bad..


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED


Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 9:51 AM
ge_forcez22 wrote:I am going to use the 2.2 ICM... it is only 8 wires so I will redo that. I got a couple more emails says that the coils may not be my issue, it is a 50/50 thing either coils or ICM, but the 2.2 one apparently fixes that... so if it does I may have to redo it all with MSD, but this is to see if something changes... good or bad..


would you mind documenting what you do, wiring-wise as I'll be doing this in the near future and i'm sure it will come in very handy. Ian says he has too much on the go right now to start another project
Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 9:52 AM
LMFAO, well, the whole job is 8 wires... and with the online manual couresty of RRCC, I am good to go.


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 10:08 AM
Engine Controls [2.2L CNG]
Engine Controls [2.2L VIN 4]


any one know which coil setup I want?? I just took it off an engine that was sitting out of a car, said 2001


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 10:08 AM
ge_forcez22 wrote:I am going to use the 2.2 ICM... it is only 8 wires so I will redo that. I got a couple more emails says that the coils may not be my issue, it is a 50/50 thing either coils or ICM, but the 2.2 one apparently fixes that... so if it does I may have to redo it all with MSD, but this is to see if something changes... good or bad..

Well good luck with it and hope everything turns out good.
Keep us in touch.
Misnblu



Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!





Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 12:39 PM
The above graph is the one I posted a loooong time ago, and it is the correct one. Now, go to MSD.COM and download the instructions for the MSD DIS2 and the instructions for the coil adaptors. They will show you which trigger wire goes where. BTW, The stock 2.2L Coils are plenty powerful enough and thats what I used. You DO NOT need the MSD coils, they offer no benefit over the GM coils other than being pretty. Good luck. And like I said, I will sell my Programable MSD DIS 2, 2.2L coils, adaptors and MSD wires as a package if anyone is interested.

<img src="http://registry.gmenthusiast.com/images/sinistercav/turbo24sol.gif">
Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 1:44 PM
welll I just finished doing the swap and it is so simple that a blind kid with aids and one arm could do it. Seriously, lol, all the wire colors match and it is a simple install and I have pics to prove it. what you need (total cost was $20, and I am no expert when it comes to wiring, that is a promise)

98+ 2.2 ICM and coil pack (removed with 3 13mm bolts)
2.2 cruise control bracket (optional)
4 plug wires
a knife
tape
soldering iron

this is the coil/ICM and the cruise control still on bracket

plug wires and spark plug wires


cruise bracket mounted to fit ICM/coils (drilled 1 hole, left rubber on bracket to prevent vibs :shrug)




stocker ICM wires

notifce the colors all match

just to make sure

connect the colors together




so after all this,,,, the car still runs the exact same... I still have a terrible misfire above 5000rpm... so maybe the stock ICM wasn't the issue, who knows... anyone got any more ideas?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Thursday, October 12, 2006 1:47 PM

HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 3:00 PM
I was back in contact with the shop where I did my dyno session, and he said that if some guys have run decent HP numbers with the ICM and coils that I am running now and I am sure that it is not power related... I should run no boost and see if the issue is still there... if the problem is gone then I have a weak ignition, and if the problem is still there, then it is clearly a grounding issues from battery to engine to tranny to head, or my crank sensor being thrown off from a combo of corrosion and poor ground.

I looked through my HPT logs and the RPM signal looks fine there... but that is at 4 FPS, and he said when checking a sensor like that you need at least 80 FPS to diagnosis. So I am going to go ground everything very well and clean that sensor... but not before I try a 24 thou gapping and a no boost run.


FPS - frames per second (for the non gamers out there)


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 3:16 PM
ge_forcez22 wrote:I was back in contact with the shop where I did my dyno session, and he said that if some guys have run decent HP numbers with the ICM and coils that I am running now and I am sure that it is not power related... I should run no boost and see if the issue is still there... if the problem is gone then I have a weak ignition, and if the problem is still there, then it is clearly a grounding issues from battery to engine to tranny to head, or my crank sensor being thrown off from a combo of corrosion and poor ground.

I looked through my HPT logs and the RPM signal looks fine there... but that is at 4 FPS, and he said when checking a sensor like that you need at least 80 FPS to diagnosis. So I am going to go ground everything very well and clean that sensor... but not before I try a 24 thou gapping and a no boost run.


FPS - frames per second (for the non gamers out there)


see garrett i TOLD you it was that simple! i've been running this setup on two separate 2.4L's for a long time now, one with and one without the aftermarket coils/wires.. imo i would spring the extra 120bux and get the two 8224 msd coils to go with it

for anyone that wants a step by step how to with instructions and explinations go to www.twistedmotorsports.net and check out my article section.


_______________________
** Flat Broke Racing Inc.**
Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 4:51 PM
ge_forcez22 wrote:I was back in contact with the shop where I did my dyno session, and he said that if some guys have run decent HP numbers with the ICM and coils that I am running now and I am sure that it is not power related... I should run no boost and see if the issue is still there... if the problem is gone then I have a weak ignition, and if the problem is still there, then it is clearly a grounding issues from battery to engine to tranny to head, or my crank sensor being thrown off from a combo of corrosion and poor ground.

I looked through my HPT logs and the RPM signal looks fine there... but that is at 4 FPS, and he said when checking a sensor like that you need at least 80 FPS to diagnosis. So I am going to go ground everything very well and clean that sensor... but not before I try a 24 thou gapping and a no boost run.


FPS - frames per second (for the non gamers out there)


ge_forcez22,
well, i'm going to wrecker to pull a set of coils and try out that coil conversion. But so you think ur hesitation could be a bad ground? I didn't look at your profile yet, but what are u using for a fuel pump? stock or the walbro?

Post up how the cleaned grounds works out. Cause if it helps, i'll have to take the time to try that out.

Nate



Evolution of Cavyboy-->C22t--> C24na--->c24s/c
1995 Cavalier W/2k1 Engine
GM S/C 13.940@99.78pmh w/2.068 60ft
Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 7:39 PM
I hope those arent stock coils your using, otherwise you might want to carry a spare in the car, they wont last very long

Bottom line if your using an MSD, use MSD coils, stock will NOT hold up



1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85






Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Thursday, October 12, 2006 10:12 PM
no MSD parts here, all just the stock 2.2 stuff. I just put on some 1 ga. grounds and changed the crank position sensor, and installed a fuel pressure gauge on my windshield.... I will post what I find out



HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Friday, October 13, 2006 2:11 AM
did you gut and rewire the 2.2 ICM, or leave it alone? The one I did, I gutted and rewired..... works great. I might get the MSD coils for when I do this to my '02.




SPD RCR Z - '02 Z24 420whp
SLO GOAT - '04 GTO 305whp
W41 BOI - '78 Buick Opel Isuzu W41 Swap

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Friday, October 13, 2006 9:55 AM
I just ran the 8 wires together with the stock harness, and plugged it all together, really simple.


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Re: LD9 External MSD/External Coil Conversion
Saturday, October 14, 2006 10:23 PM
SpeedRacerZ wrote:did you gut and rewire the 2.2 ICM, or leave it alone? The one I did, I gutted and rewired..... works great. I might get the MSD coils for when I do this to my '02.


no need to do all of that rewiring, the icm is just a control module that bases it's decisions on what information the sensors feed it. there is literally no difference in the 2.2/2200/2.4L ICM's basically just how the coils are mounted!




_______________________
** Flat Broke Racing Inc.**
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