ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank - Performance Forum

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ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Saturday, November 26, 2016 11:27 PM
Any help on where I can find one? I've asked around with GM, Eagle and Crower with no results, and nothing recent in the forum.

Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Sunday, November 27, 2016 2:15 AM
Eagle made a forged one years ago, but I don't recall anyone making a billet crank. How much power are you looking to make?




Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Monday, November 28, 2016 1:09 AM
Estimates are approximations. Initially I'm building to roughly 250 HP /260 lb-ft, then to 350 HP (not sure yet what torque will look like in this area or above), then to 550 as a weekend warrior. Should I take it more seriously, then 750 HP and if I'm feeling good I'll take it over 1,000. I plan to get to the neighborhood of 250 on stock internals while I add a Saab turbo, but within a few months from now I'm purchasing the rods and pistons with a lower comp ratio to get safely to higher boost levels. My thoughts were that I'm safe to probably 500 lb-ft if I send an OEM crank out to be shot peened and cryotreated, but I would rather build the motor to handle the high power now and build in increments. Which if I got the crank I would jump straight to 500ish horsepower/torque.
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Monday, November 28, 2016 2:06 AM
Your best bet at finding one is by contacting Karo at AllEcotec.com. Last I knew he had a line on the uncommon Ecotec parts.

1000hp is not going to be easy out of an Ecotec. I wouldn't lower the CR. The extra compression will help make power and shouldn't be bad to tune with a standalone like MS3. Knock shouldn't be too much of an issue with water/meth injection and 110+ Octane fuel.




Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Monday, November 28, 2016 2:28 PM
Crower makes a billet crank, and they will reproduce them if you order 5 or more at $1,950 per piece. So who's got $10,000 to blow on the j-body forum? Haha

GM used them to build their dragster ecotecs for some time. At the 500 hp mark if the compression isn't lowered then there is the issue of blowing past the gasket on the sides of the head, so lowering compression or machining new stud holes is the fix. Of course lowering compression will only go so far to reduce combustion pressure so eventually greater reinforcement will be needed anyway.

But I'd rather not send off an OEM crank for a 10% increase in tensile and torsional strength for an engine I'm going to have go vo over the top to make rigid enough to handle insane power. I'd rather start with her billet stuff and build up. So likely what will happen is I'll put on the turbo, then add crank and other stuff, then turn it sideways and slap on the big boy toys.
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Saturday, December 03, 2016 5:31 AM
The GM drag motors, had much higher compression than anyone thinks.

I have tuned a bone stock internal 2.2 Ecotec to 405whp. Stock crank is fine.



FU Tuning



Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Saturday, December 03, 2016 11:10 AM
Yeah but have you got 800hp on a road car with the stock crank? I appreciate the build advice guys, but my plans are set. I want to buy a billet crankshaft for my 2.2. I seriously doubt I could get four more people on a group buy so I want to see who's got one already. If that's not possible, or takes too long, I go back to the drawing board.
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Saturday, December 03, 2016 3:52 PM
Jason Gibbs wrote:

Yeah but have you got 800hp on a road car with the stock crank? I appreciate the build advice guys, but my plans are set. I want to buy a billet crankshaft for my 2.2. I seriously doubt I could get four more people on a group buy so I want to see who's got one already. If that's not possible, or takes too long, I go back to the drawing board.


Not being a dick, but go back to the drawing board.

800hp on a road car that is FWD is a major waste.



FU Tuning



Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:20 PM
I agree that an 800hp FWD is a waste. Which is why I said "turn it sideways," then "slap on the big boy toys." At same point an RWD will be in the works.

It may need to be that i build a second powertrain or full car anyway if I need to do some digging for parts like this. Just build pne hard-to-find piece at a time. :S Sounds like j-body is on it's qay out quickly for racing enthusiasm anymore.
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Saturday, December 03, 2016 8:24 PM
You have to keep in mind that we've seen lots of people join these forums over the years with huge build plans that never amount to anything...

Gm has proven the stock crank to over 500 hp... if you've got the $$ to spend, then by all means buy a billet crank.




Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Saturday, December 03, 2016 9:35 PM
Well no build ever does go exactly to plan, not even those who have the money to buy everything they want.

I was hoping to hit some luck here with the crank but I've got to go a little farther with my research I guess. Anyway, part of my project is for educational materials for other performance enthusiasts, and maybe sway some ricers too. The idea is that planning your build around the end goal yields better results than just putting together a bunch of high end pieces and guess working everything. So in the spring when I'll have everything together, I'll do the build and put it on YouTube. Until then, it's a matter of getting it together.

Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Sunday, December 04, 2016 4:22 PM
Eagle crank will do fine for 800hp. Bigger issue is not the parts, but how is it going to be tuned? What system will it run on to get 800hp?



FU Tuning



Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Sunday, December 04, 2016 6:55 PM
I'll start with the OE PCM and upgrade as necessary to an AEM standalone. Local shop uses HP tuner.
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Sunday, December 04, 2016 7:28 PM
AEM or Megasquirt. I hear a lot of good reviews on those.
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Monday, December 05, 2016 5:16 PM
Jason Gibbs wrote:

I'll start with the OE PCM and upgrade as necessary to an AEM standalone. Local shop uses HP tuner.


i got a stock ECU to 405whp, but we were on the edge of what it could handle.

I have dealt with Megasquirt in a older 300zx and Miata. hands down awesome!!!




FU Tuning



Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Monday, December 05, 2016 7:41 PM
I've heard the OE PCM is a beast, but never had the chance to mutz around with it.

I had a 90Z and was contemplating an OBDII swap, until the wife blew up the tranny. If I remember right that OBDII had removable EEPROM? Or was that the I's?
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Tuesday, December 06, 2016 2:57 PM
Addicted to meth wrote:

The GM drag motors, had much higher compression than anyone thinks.

I have tuned a bone stock internal 2.2 Ecotec to 405whp. Stock crank is fine.



Out of curiosity how did you tune the motor for 405 horse? What did you do to the rods and pistons specifically? I can see where the rods failed at their breaking point considering nitrous was their induction type.
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Tuesday, December 06, 2016 2:59 PM
That is, where they failed in GM's initial race testing. Also, what rpm range are you making power? Head flow rate?
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Thursday, December 08, 2016 5:35 PM
Jason Gibbs wrote:

Addicted to meth wrote:

The GM drag motors, had much higher compression than anyone thinks.

I have tuned a bone stock internal 2.2 Ecotec to 405whp. Stock crank is fine.



Out of curiosity how did you tune the motor for 405 horse? What did you do to the rods and pistons specifically? I can see where the rods failed at their breaking point considering nitrous was their induction type.


We were using the factory ECU tuning with HPTuners, but it was a pain to tune.

Rods and pistons were factory stock, no mods, stock ring gap. We were reving to 7k.

405whp pul



FU Tuning



Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Thursday, December 08, 2016 7:25 PM
Shot peen? Cryo treat? Balance? Anything?
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Friday, December 09, 2016 1:55 PM
Jason Gibbs wrote:

Shot peen? Cryo treat? Balance? Anything?


Nothing. Stock, stock, stock, stock. Stock bearings, rings etc..



FU Tuning




Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Friday, December 09, 2016 2:06 PM
That's something else.
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Sunday, December 11, 2016 8:23 AM
Jason Gibbs wrote:

That's something else.


I will be very clear and have said it before. We made 2 full passes at the high boost setting. Second run she was rattling bad. We turned it down to 16psi making 333whp. Motor ran that way for a while until torn down for a rebuild. It was in a car that weight 2000lb which helps.

I'm sure another pass on the high boost setting it was coming apart.



FU Tuning



Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Sunday, December 11, 2016 11:06 AM
To see it survive 405 whp for two passes I feel is extraordinary. Definitely a feat for the books. So in the worst case scenario I think I'd be up for new rods, wrist pins, and bearings, and back off the boost and retard spark/cam phasing until the power is right just in case of rattling.

And weight reduction is something I posted in another thread but I'll ask here. At 2,000 lbs was the vehicle still "steetable?" I mean could you see the pavement through the floor? If this was a j-body, what did you do to reduce the weight that much?

For clarity, here is my proposed end build:
-Beta Block and cradle
-Billet crank, (possible destroked but planning on OEM for now due to lack of parts), lightened, knife-edged, shot peeked, cryo, micro-polished
-Carillo Rods
-Wiseco Pistons 86.5mm
-Piston oil squirters
-Chrome-moly rings
-Darton OEM spec sleeves, bored .5mm over
-Clevite Bearings all around
-Balance delete with electric water pump
-ARP U-bolts (through cradle, block, and head; fights horizontal cradle shifting under high RPM and boost)
-High volume oil pump, dry sump system
-Direct port injection, twin fuel rail with one pressure regulator
-HAHN intake manifold
-COMP Cams, with adjustable cam gears
-Dual coil valve springs, titanium components, over-sized valves, maybe bronze guides
-Copper head gasket, ported and polished head, flow benched of course, probably an LSJ head
-Jackets and oil passages resized and deburred
-Dual fuel pump system, 1200cc injectors (8)
-AEM or Megasquirt
-T56 or TR6070 swap. I'm partial to the TR6070 but if completion rides on budget, I'll end with T56.

With the RWD swap the fuel tank will be moved to the trunk. IRS rear, and we'll see what happens when I get THAT far down the road. Also I will be converting to belt driven power steering or just ditching it altogether to install distributor type ignition with an MSD spark controller. It will be a single turbo with an air water intercooler. Heat exchanger will be added for coolant, (turbo will have a coolant heat exchanger as well on a dedicated loop) engine oil pre turbo, transmission oil, power steering if applicable.

By this point street ability will be completely out the window, and that's okay. In the end it will simply be a track warrior. By the time I've got everything together for this build my kids will likely be in college. But most of this stuff will still be available, so it's about getting the hard to find stuff now before I can't get it anymore or the price is outrageous. This isn't even half of everything to be done but it should give a good idea of the powertrain I'm looking to move forward with. Like said, it will start as a street car, then become a track car.
Re: ISO 2.2 Billet L61 crank
Sunday, December 11, 2016 2:49 PM
You should look at this post: RWD Ecotec

It was this car. It was streetable.



FU Tuning



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