1.8L Turbo timing belt cover - First Generation Forum

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1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Sunday, July 10, 2016 6:22 PM
I am the proud owner of a 1984 Pontiac Sunbird Turbo Convertable with Pontiac Fiero Rims. I'm currently fixing a blown head gasket to make this car my daily driver. This car is missing the Front Cover/Timing belt cover. (Previous owner thought it wasn't necessary I guess. I'm having some head work done and am afraid of a rock coming from the road and snapping my belt and causing mayhem with my sweet ride. cant seem to find one. Does anyone have one they will part with?

Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Wednesday, July 13, 2016 6:09 AM
Well, the good news is that the cover is not turbo specific, so you don't have to be that picky. The bad news is that the fit of the early plastic covers was not great, and if someone replacing the water pump was lazy and didn't get it back on right, the power steering belt will rub and cut through the cover. At that point it REALLY fits bad. That's probably why it was left off, and I've seen plenty of them in the yards that were practically cut in half (back when we had plenty of these in the yards).

Any 1.8 cover from '82 to '86 will work just fine, I want to say they changed it in '87 when they punched the 1.8 out to 2.0. One of these days I'll try adapting the better fitting cover of my junk '93 2.0 over to my '84 turbo, but I've got bigger fish to fry at the moment.


-Matt

82 Skyhawk Convertible: https://goo.gl/j7R6Cu
83 P/2K Turbo: http://goo.gl/EVKPX6
86 Firenza Cruiser: "Jack-Wagon" https://goo.gl/bWP2uK
87 Skyhawk Custom: http://goo.gl/krdDeU
90 Sunbird GT: "Turbo-Turd"
93 Sunbird Convertible: "FrankenBird"
(and a pair of Cavaliers I'd rather not talk about)
Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Wednesday, July 13, 2016 7:41 AM
The 2.0 doesn't have the cast-in section behind the sprocket on the cam carrier that the 1.8 does and the 2.0 uses a stamped metal backing plate that bolts to the block. I'd think they would interfere and it might be a pain to adapt the 2.0 one.

I usually leave them off because it's easier to change the timing belt, and I've never had a problem with junk getting in there - have daily driven many thousand miles this way. It's actually pretty shielded from road debris, but that's up to you. I could see wanting it on there for that one in a billion chance something big got up there maybe, just doesn't seem too likely in my opinion. That being said, if you want one I don't intend to put mine back on, but I don't remember what kind of shape it's in.


86 Skyhawk wagon 1.8SOHC 93 Sunbird two door 2.0SOHC 93 Sunbird four door 2.0SOHC
Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Thursday, July 14, 2016 8:53 AM
drivesa5 wrote:

The 2.0 doesn't have the cast-in section behind the sprocket on the cam carrier that the 1.8 does and the 2.0 uses a stamped metal backing plate that bolts to the block. I'd think they would interfere and it might be a pain to adapt the 2.0 one.


Yeah, I've got a couple spare 2.0 cam carriers lying around that I'd slide in there. It's obviously a lot of work with little pay-off, which is why I haven't done it yet. Not worth busting the seals for a superficial fix, I just always thought the fit of the original plastic cover looked cheesy. I didn't have these 2.0 motors the last time I tore into one of the 1.8s, and the next one I tear into is one I'm trying to keep as original as possible so I'll leave it as-is.



-Matt

82 Skyhawk Convertible: https://goo.gl/j7R6Cu
83 P/2K Turbo: http://goo.gl/EVKPX6
86 Firenza Cruiser: "Jack-Wagon" https://goo.gl/bWP2uK
87 Skyhawk Custom: http://goo.gl/krdDeU
90 Sunbird GT: "Turbo-Turd"
93 Sunbird Convertible: "FrankenBird"
(and a pair of Cavaliers I'd rather not talk about)
Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Tuesday, July 19, 2016 6:43 PM
Thanks for the replies. after looking at it a little closer I don't think the cover would offer protection from where I'm worried about anyway so I'll probably leave it off. I've got the head off the beast and can't wait for this weekend to assemble everything and do some cruising. I labeled everything except the heater hose pipe. Can't figure out how the heck that thing goes on. Do you guys have any experience with head replacement on these machines?
Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Tuesday, July 19, 2016 7:20 PM
Just my 2 cents worth, friend.

The Brazil engine is not an interference engine so even if the worst came to pass you would just need to put on a new belt and life would be good again.

Also the water pump is located down low on the engine and it allows for easy monitoring to make sure you don't have any leaks there.

The head uses Torque to fit bolts and are good for one use only. There is a procedure where you install the head and torque the bolts, run the engine up to operating temperature and then torque the bolts additional number of degrees ( have to check my manual for proper specs).

Also I'd recommend grabbing a Factory Shop Manual off of EBay:

Here is one for $30 and worth every penny my friend!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-GM-PONTIAC-SUNBIRD-2000-Service-Shop-Repair-Manual-84-FACTORY-OEM-BOOK-1984-/161419927035?hash=item2595609dfb:m:mbPmTxNZLf0XY7PR6cm1ZFg&vxp=mtr



Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Tuesday, July 19, 2016 7:24 PM
Also please have your head checked when you replace the gasket. These aluminium heads had a history of cracking between the valve seats. In fact I am currently in need of doing the head gasket too on my "84 N/A Sunbird, and on my to do list is having the head checked at the shop.



Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Tuesday, July 19, 2016 8:15 PM
David Smith wrote:

I've got the head off the beast and can't wait for this weekend to assemble everything and do some cruising. I labeled everything except the heater hose pipe. Can't figure out how the heck that thing goes on. Do you guys have any experience with head replacement on these machines?


Are you kidding? After I turbo'd my first J, I used to change head gaskets like most people change oil (invest in a good torque wrench, kids). Are you puzzled on the installation of the tube itself, or where the hoses go from the tube?


-Matt

82 Skyhawk Convertible: https://goo.gl/j7R6Cu
83 P/2K Turbo: http://goo.gl/EVKPX6
86 Firenza Cruiser: "Jack-Wagon" https://goo.gl/bWP2uK
87 Skyhawk Custom: http://goo.gl/krdDeU
90 Sunbird GT: "Turbo-Turd"
93 Sunbird Convertible: "FrankenBird"
(and a pair of Cavaliers I'd rather not talk about)
Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Monday, July 25, 2016 2:14 PM
Got the tube figured out . Everything is back together. Can't figure out the timing marks though. Cam Mark is lined up with the mark on the cam carrier. Where should the mark on the crankshaft pulley be? I invested in a repair manual but it's a little short on details

Any help would be awesome
Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Friday, July 29, 2016 4:30 AM
There's a C shaped cutout/mark on the crank sprocket which you can only see really with the crank pulley off. It matches one on the oil pump housing. Generally it's pointing straight down.

Agreed. Done the head replacement a lot of times. Am in the middle of another cracked one now actually. Not a turbo though.


86 Skyhawk wagon 1.8SOHC 93 Sunbird two door 2.0SOHC 93 Sunbird four door 2.0SOHC
Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Friday, July 29, 2016 6:43 PM
drivesa5, where do you prefer to source your heads from?

.




Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Friday, July 29, 2016 7:08 PM
Interesting. So the timing mark is not the mark on the large diameter pulley on the crank shaft? I lined that mark up at 8degree btdc and the top one on the cam with the mark on cam housing. Got no firing action at all. I've got another issue I'm fighting now in that cylinder #2 has no compression at all after a new head and gasket. Had to quit working on the beast for a day or two because I was so upset about that. Not sure what's going on with it....rings? Bad reman head? Have you ever pulled the motor out of one of these? Thinking about staring from the bottom up and making it purr like new. The car is in really good shape. (No rust at all). Just wish it ran as summer will be turning to fall shortly
Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Sunday, July 31, 2016 4:30 AM
The compression issue might be because your cam timing is wrong.
Re: 1.8L Turbo timing belt cover
Monday, August 01, 2016 4:45 AM
I agree with Ray. Check your cam timing first; the cam timing mark is on the crank sprocket and isn't the same as the timing mark on the big pulley. Also I agree that your rings aren't likely to have gone bad between heads. Unless you have a ton of hard miles, I'd also be surprised if your bottom end is bad. They are pretty tough really. I have pulled several engines. They all look pretty nice on the bottom end, crosshatching and all; one had almost 250k on it. Not saying it can't happen.

I know you didn't change your cam, but believe it or not I had a replacement cam that had to be one tooth off to run. I'm guessing they put the dowel hole in the wrong place for the cam sprocket to align correctly. It illustrates what seemingly a small amount off of cam timing can do. It was a little frustrating when even lining all the marks up and it wouldn't fire at all. Took me a bit to figure that one out.

Orlen, the one that just cracked I grabbed on short notice off ebay. J&C is the co. The head looked fair, but only lasted a year. I have another I got from Rockauto that was a little more money but is uglier than the ebay one (the welds where they fixed the lands between the seats were not really smoothed out a all, etc.) I am putting that one on now because I didn't feel like buying another. It is a modified one I cut down the valve guides and opened up the throats at the seats, not to mention having to clean up the chamgers a little, but I decided to try it anyway. I am debating sending my (growing pile of) heads to a local engine machine shop I trust to do the seat repairs in hopes their knowledge and someone doing a quality job will make them last longer since any online seem to be hit or miss; or I may have a welder I know do them and I rebuild the rest. I'm not sure yet.

I also have a theory that starting the car and immediately driving off and not letting it warm up at all may help contribute to the cracking ... i.e. the different metals and their rates of expansion aren't given time to settle in, in conjunction with the poor design with not enough material there between the seats. Any thoughts on that?


86 Skyhawk wagon 1.8SOHC 93 Sunbird two door 2.0SOHC 93 Sunbird four door 2.0SOHC
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