Looking for suspension advice. - Suspension and Brake Forum

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Looking for suspension advice.
Thursday, April 10, 2014 1:47 PM
So I've been considering doing the suspension on my sunfire and I decided I want to save up and upgrade it eventually. So in order not to be the guy that gets flamed for doing something stupid I've been doing some research now. Ideally what I'd like to do is keep at least stock height or maybe even a 1-1.5 inch lift. Yes I am serious.

Now before the mockery starts let me explain why. I've always been in higher riding cars even before I was driving so my sunfire is like sitting on the ground already for me so I don't want to lower at all. Second I live in Michigan so to put it nicely the roads are crap. And finally it think it would look kinda cool to lift it.

So a few questions if you're still with me. Can you keep stock height with AGXs? Or do they just work with lowering? If AGX will only lower the car what would be a good alternative I was thinking GR 2s perhaps?

For springs are there any springs out there that are upgrades that aren't lowering? I know for example WRXs have lots of options for lifts is it possible to use springs for another car (i know this works on some cars I didn't know if there is an option for j body's though).

I haven't really found much on this because well everyone lowers j body's so any advice or comments are welcome. If this is just a bad idea I understand I won't just go ahead with a plan if it's unsafe or something like that.


2002 Pontiac Sunfire SE Sedan 2.2l Ecotec 4 Speed Auto.

Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Thursday, April 10, 2014 2:14 PM
Search!!
There was a very similar thread to this not too long ago.
Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Thursday, April 10, 2014 4:12 PM
You mean this one? Whats needed to lift my car

Lumina springs were suggested there along with spacers but no confirmation of weather or not the lumina springs would work. I'm looking more to upgrade than go with a OEM replacement type setup anyway though. Spacers are okay but I'd rather not use them if I can find a setup that doesn't need them.

If all else fails I could use the Megan racing springs and AGXs like in this thread and maybe add in some spacers later.
My 03' Sedan and 04' Coupe Sunfires





2002 Pontiac Sunfire SE Sedan 2.2l Ecotec 4 Speed Auto.
Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Thursday, April 10, 2014 7:12 PM
If you go with the Megan Racing springs, you'll lower your car about 2 inches. Not sure you're going to like it if you say you want to keep stock ride height or even lift it. The spring rate is pretty stiff on the Megans too, so if you're telling the roads are pretty harsh where you live that's maybe another factor which will make you dislike those. I personally love my setup on my sedan but it's made for a clean road. As far as aftermarket springs, to my knowledge they all lower the car. I guess the easiest way to do it will be with the lumina springs like told by others before, or with spacing.

You asked if you can stay on stock height on AGXs. There should not be a problem since the shocks have the same lenght than the stock ones. Actually IIRC they are basically GR-2s (which are stock replacement parts) with a adjustable damping added.




Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Thursday, April 10, 2014 7:37 PM
Dampers don't affect ride height only springs do.

Get a set of coilovers and use longer springs.



Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Friday, April 11, 2014 5:50 AM
Nicola thanks for the answers I thought the AGXs wouldn't affect ride height but somewhere I saw someone saying you can't install them without a drop. I know the Megan's will lower the car they would be my last option if I can't find what I'm looking for btw your build was the first one I saw on j body it is awesome! I wanted to build my car rally style so I love your build!

This was on the lifting thread

-MD- Enforcer wrote:

99 Grand AM 2.4l
Front:
Inside Diameter=5.526" Wire Diameter=.609" Free Height=12.56" Load height=9"
Rear:
-- Inside Diameter=4.111" Wire Diameter=.473" Free Height=15.63" Load height=10"

99 Z24 Cav.

Front:
-- Inside Diameter=4.894" Wire Diameter=.562" Free Height=13.19" Load height=9"
Rear:
-- Inside Diameter=4.19" Wire Diameter=.468" Free Height=14.25" Load height=10"

99 Lumina 3.1l
Front:
-- Inside Diameter=6.937" Wire Diameter=.625" Free Height=15.97" Load height=13"
Rear:
-- Inside Diameter=5.427" Wire Diameter=.541" Free Height=15.88" Load height=10"

99 Malibu 2.4l
Front:
-- Inside Diameter=5.526" Wire Diameter=.609" Free Height=12.56" Load height=9"
Rear:
-- Inside Diameter=4.111" Wire Diameter=.473" Free Height=15.63" Load height=10"

99 Grand Prix GTP
Front:
-- Inside Diameter=5.43" Wire Diameter=.541" Free Height=13.78" Load height=9"
Rear:
-- Inside Diameter=5.43" Wire Diameter=.541" Free Height=13.31" Load height=9"

I bet GM did us the Lumina Springs for the Moab ZR24


So in theory if you got lumina springs with a 1-2 inch drop in front it should still be at least stock height right? The issue would be the rear springs lowering though since they have the same load height if I'm looking at this correctly.


2002 Pontiac Sunfire SE Sedan 2.2l Ecotec 4 Speed Auto.
Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Friday, April 11, 2014 6:09 AM
James Cahill wrote:

Dampers don't affect ride height only springs do.

Get a set of coilovers and use longer springs.

This would be the best way to go about it. Your other option is stock springs on AGX's or D-Specs if you want to go a little cheaper.

You could try the lumina springs or complete strut assembly but like you mentioned no one has ever documented an actual attempt to see if it would really work.



"In Oldskool we trust"
Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Friday, April 11, 2014 9:54 PM
James Cahill wrote:

Dampers don't affect ride height only springs do.

Get a set of coilovers and use longer springs.


technically, the outbacks get their lift from a different strut vs the regular legacy but it has to do with location of the lower spring perch mounted to the strut.

james is right though, i'd look at coilovers where you have the ability to set the location of the spring perch (and/or mounting to the knuckle depending on the coilover setup) to adjust your ride height. keep in mind though, depending on how high you go, you may run into problems with the cv joints in the axles binding.





Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Saturday, April 12, 2014 2:33 PM
strat81 wrote:


technically, the outbacks get their lift from a different strut vs the regular legacy but it has to do with location of the lower spring perch mounted to the strut.

james is right though, i'd look at coilovers where you have the ability to set the location of the spring perch (and/or mounting to the knuckle depending on the coilover setup) to adjust your ride height. keep in mind though, depending on how high you go, you may run into problems with the cv joints in the axles binding.


Sorry I meant the forester spring swap you can use to lift an outback. You take the springs from a forester and put them on an outback for a roughly 1.5 inch lift you just have to use forester tophats to seat the springs correctly.

I wouldn't plan on a ton of lift at the most 1.5 inches over what I'm at now which should be slightly lower than stock since there's 107k on the original suspension so I don't think cv joints will be an issue. I'll have to start researching coilovers since I don't know too much about them what is the performance and ride like on a good set? I was kinda hoping to use the AGXs since I've seen a lot of good stuff about them maybe once I measure my ride height I'll already be close to a 2 inch drop from the stock ride height lol


2002 Pontiac Sunfire SE Sedan 2.2l Ecotec 4 Speed Auto.
Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Tuesday, April 15, 2014 10:02 AM
Well I researched coilovers and the only ones I could afford are the tein basic and street basis but it seems like both of them will end up lowering the car slightly. As a side note do eibach or Megan racing make coilovers for j body's? I thought I'd seen people with eibach coilovers in threads on here but they didn't list any on the website.
I also looked a rebound at springs since I figure if I am going to end up slightly lower anyway I might as well look at other options, so there is still
The Megan springs

These eibach pro kits ( they have less drop than the Megan's do the website in the link below says 1.4 inch drop)
http://www.autoanything.com/suspension-systems/61A2549A0A0.aspx

These ST Sporttech springs ( these have the least drop 1.2 inches)
http://www.autoanything.com/suspension-systems/61A3355A0A0.aspx

And these B&G S2 Sports (1.6 inch drop)
http://www.autoanything.com/suspension-systems/73A4457A0A0.aspx

All would be on KYB AGXs overall what would be the option for best performance? I wasn't sure how the lower end coilovers would compare to higher end springs from what I've found it says coilovers will out perform comparable springs but require more fine tuning.
I do like the option with the springs/AGX combo of having adjustable damper which those particular teins don't seem to have. Seeing that I pretty much am going to end up lowered to some extent helped me decide just to go with the better performing setup so though I don't want to go too crazy I don't mind lowering it a bit. What do you guys think? I would like stay under $700 though with the springs and AGXs I could stay under $600 and maybe do swaybars or a tiebar.



2002 Pontiac Sunfire SE Sedan 2.2l Ecotec 4 Speed Auto.
Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Tuesday, April 15, 2014 10:09 AM
Eibach doesn't make coilovers for our cars, but Ground Control makes coilovers that use the Eibach springs.

If you were to get the Teins, you could always change out your springs. There are quite a few reputable coil spring manufacturers, including QA1, Eibach, Afco, etc. that sell multiple different height springs with multiple different rates, and Tein probably even makes some that will do what you want.

For example, I believe most coilovers for our cars use 8" springs (uncompressed height). You could swap out a set of 10" springs and it would give you some lift. This is exactly what James was suggesting. It's your best route.






Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Tuesday, April 15, 2014 12:32 PM
Ok thanks that sounds like the better option. Sorry if this is pretty basic stuff but I don't have any experience with coilovers I've only worked with regular springs and struts on trucks, SUVs, stuff like that where there more support for lifting or keeping stock height.

So could I get coilovers without the springs and then get the springs separately? I did look at ground control and they have a much better price than the teins plus they build to order so maybe they could build them with 10 inch springs on them?


2002 Pontiac Sunfire SE Sedan 2.2l Ecotec 4 Speed Auto.
Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Tuesday, April 15, 2014 5:06 PM
The point I was trying to make is that you can also achieve the lift by moving the lower spring perch up. It's how Subaru lifted the outback vs the standard legacy.

Coilovers allow you to adjust the position of the lower perch by way of a threaded collar. Since there aren't companies making like king making aftermarket lift springs and gm doesn't share too many parts between platforms (legacy/impreza/forester parts are all interchangeable), a coilover setup is likely your best option.



Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Wednesday, April 16, 2014 6:09 AM
strat81 wrote:

The point I was trying to make is that you can also achieve the lift by moving the lower spring perch up. It's how Subaru lifted the outback vs the standard legacy.

Coilovers allow you to adjust the position of the lower perch by way of a threaded collar. Since there aren't companies making like king making aftermarket lift springs and gm doesn't share too many parts between platforms (legacy/impreza/forester parts are all interchangeable), a coilover setup is likely your best option.


Ok I see what you mean. I thought it was my post that wasn't clear enough. Trust me when it comes to subarus and especially legacy/outback I know them pretty well I'm actually looking at rebuilding one sometime soon just for fun.


2002 Pontiac Sunfire SE Sedan 2.2l Ecotec 4 Speed Auto.
Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Wednesday, April 16, 2014 7:44 AM
backpacker3 wrote:

So could I get coilovers without the springs and then get the springs separately? I did look at ground control and they have a much better price than the teins plus they build to order so maybe they could build them with 10 inch springs on them?
Keep in mind that Ground Control is much cheaper than Tein because you aren't getting the struts with them. Teins are complete setups. Ground Control requires that you modify the struts you have (should be HP Blues, D-Specs, Konis, or AGXs) by removing the spring perch and then installing the coilovers.

With the Ground Control, though, you should be able to order the springs you want.





Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Friday, April 18, 2014 6:56 PM
Mr. Quick wrote:

With the Ground Control, though, you should be able to order the springs you want.


You can. And they will price it as a normal kit. Tell them exactly what you want to do and they will give you their recommendation for rates and lengths.



Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Saturday, April 19, 2014 6:56 PM
Awesome! Thanks for the tip.


2002 Pontiac Sunfire SE Sedan 2.2l Ecotec 4 Speed Auto.
Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Tuesday, May 13, 2014 7:14 PM
Can someone post links to all the parts needed for a 2-3" lift? as cheap as possible without re-using old parts.

My sig- "Doing what needs to be done, although satisfactory, is a far cry from what can be done."
Re: Looking for suspension advice.
Tuesday, July 08, 2014 5:17 PM
This is probably a ridiculous question but would it be possible to use chevy tracker lowering springs to keep the stock height of my car and still have a better spring than the OEM replacement? I know the lumina springs are supposed to work so maybe the tracker springs could work too?

I need to do a. It more research to find out what lowering springs I would need like if it's 2 or 3 inches of lowering but who knows it might work.


2002 Pontiac Sunfire SE Sedan 2.2l Ecotec 4 Speed Auto.
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