some progress info on the V6 swap - Page 13 - Third Generation Forum

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Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Sunday, September 10, 2006 3:52 PM
SHOoff wrote:Joe, you want an aftermarket gauge or what? I'm pretty sure autometer has gauges that will read the fuel level.


pretty sure the autometer gauge is plug and play, as well as the electronic speedo and tach.




Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Monday, September 11, 2006 5:25 AM
Looked up autometer gauges, All I see is a universal thats 240-33 ohm. Thats the backwards one.
For now I have the one that i bought thats backwards installed. It still works I just have to remember that its backwards. Oh, its a digital readout that tells the percentage, in my case its the % air in the tank. Its correct at half tank.

If you can find the part# of the autometer gauge that works correctly can you post it for me.


01 cav w/01 3400 gam gt 4t45e

Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Monday, September 11, 2006 4:10 PM
summit racing Autometer ATM-7114 programmable empty /full. 0-280 ohm programmable empty/full.







Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Monday, September 11, 2006 9:41 PM
Ok... so in summary, just to make sure I'm on the right rabbit trail, the stock lower mount can be used and a new upper mount from a 2k1 Alero w/ a 3.1 (aside from the obvious rewiring and whatnot) Putting together a parts list of the non-obvious parts to prep for this swap...

Another Sunfire planning to join the V6-5spd club









Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Monday, September 11, 2006 11:07 PM
Thanks hotbug,

Kardain, The upper mount that I used is the alero, 3.4. (alero didnt come with a 3.1) Im sure that the gam and malibu v-6 mounts are the same. The lower mount is still in question. Yes Im running the stock cav lower but It was cut and reworked . the off set rubber center was turned around , and reinstalled . the mount works till I can figure out some better way. Basically the lower mount is my problem cause Im running A/c still and the alt. hits on the dryer when you mash the pedal to the floor. The cav mount will get you by till you find out what your going to need for clearance.
Use a hard mount in this place and your fillings will vibrate out while holding on to the steering wheel.

Another possibility would be the stock lower mount for like a monecarlo with the 3.4. It is a direct bolt on to the pan but the subframe is going to have to be modified on that side.

It just seems that just the one torque mount isnt enough to keep the engine from looking like it wants to pop out of there. The Gam, malibu and alero have 4 engine/tranny mounts, and they are monsters like the one that I used on the Passenger rail. The torque mounts bolt to the front and back of the trans housing. 2 monster bolts on each.

So for lack of knowing which way Im going, the cav mount works for now.





01 cav w/01 3400 gam gt 4t45e

Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Monday, September 11, 2006 11:16 PM
Ok, so the stock mount is out... Has there been a determination on the RKSport/Prothane lower dogbone w/ no modifications (as that's what I'm currently running)?

I can get that cut and rewelded if need be (with a smaller diameter pipe as an insert for some added strength)...

If it does need to be modded, what's the estimated shrinkage/addition? 3 hours of reading this post + 2 days of the other one = brain overload

One of the plans for the engine is a full teardown and blueprinting to cut down on the vibes.









Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Monday, September 11, 2006 11:32 PM
I didnt go with that prothane mount because some one on here said that It would work but it will cause engine vibrations to go through the car.
I had 2 stock bones , cut them in half , welded them back together, and put that on. It sucked, vibration city........

If thats what your using. I would build your mount off of your oil pan, mount the prothane bone. see what your clearances are and cut to fit. If you design the bracket a little big you may be able to just drill the whole where you need it and not cut anything. I only cut a little out of my cav mount, I think it was somewhere around an inch. If I were you I would definetly cut it (after) you get it mounted.


01 cav w/01 3400 gam gt 4t45e

Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Tuesday, September 12, 2006 1:07 PM
Alrighty, that sounds like a better idea (since most cars are a tad different). I don't plan on this swap until next year, so if someone happens to figure this out the exact measurement... if not, I'll post up what I figured out

I was debating doing the 2.4 swap, but either way, I would have to rewire the car, so this will be SO worth it in the end









Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Wednesday, September 13, 2006 3:24 PM
Ok , I just ordered another gauge, It appears that the autometer ATM-7114 and the dakota digital have a gauge that will work. The dakota digital part# is
DAK-SLX-06-1-K. I think the ATM-6114 will also work. Both are avail. from Summit Racing.
Thanks Hotbug!


01 cav w/01 3400 gam gt 4t45e

Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Thursday, September 14, 2006 1:34 AM
joe malechowski wrote:Ok , I just ordered another gauge, It appears that the autometer ATM-7114 and the dakota digital have a gauge that will work. The dakota digital part# is
DAK-SLX-06-1-K. I think the ATM-6114 will also work. Both are avail. from Summit Racing.
Thanks Hotbug!


glad to be of help.



Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Saturday, September 16, 2006 7:43 AM
Kardain wrote:Ok... so in summary, just to make sure I'm on the right rabbit trail, the stock lower mount can be used and a new upper mount from a 2k1 Alero w/ a 3.1 (aside from the obvious rewiring and whatnot) Putting together a parts list of the non-obvious parts to prep for this swap...

Another Sunfire planning to join the V6-5spd club

I would highly recommend the 94-97 GAM upper mount. Look at my second picture on page 1 of this thread.
That mount bolts right into the J-body bracket that is already in the car. Everything lines up perfectly. The bracket will bolt right to most late model 3x00 engines, but for fitment of accessories in the J-body engine bay, get an engine from an Alero, GAM, Century. The Monte Carlo, Grand Prix, and Malibu engines use a wider accessory setup. There are other cars with this engine, but I don't know how the accessory brackets are in them.

For the bottom mount, I used the GAM lower mount with the bracket for the dogbone moved inward to line up with the subframe.
Mr. Goodwrench made a custom mount that consists of a plate that screws to the pan and the bolt hole just below the timing cover.







Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Tuesday, September 19, 2006 7:48 AM
Hey, for anyone who is planning the swap, here is another possible programmer for the PCM....

http://www.milzymotorsports.com/miva/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=MMS&Product_Code=PCM-3400
Note: You can also have us do custom settings like anything added or removed. We will charge a maximum of $75.00 extra. The additional charge will be based off what is done. After the purchase we will contact you with the additional cost.


I shot him an e-mail last night:
Quote:


For this item, is it possible to remove the auto trans settings altogether (swapping in an Isuzu MK7 tranny from a Cavalier into my GrandAm)? Also, would future tuning by the end user be possible w/ HPTuners or is this a locked PCM?

Regards,

Rob


(I may have the exact tranny specs wrong, and changed it up a bit but the concept is still the same)

And here's the response:
Quote:


At this point in time, I do not lock my PCM’s, so anyone with tuning software can change parameters in it.

I can remove any trans table settings in the pcm as wel as any DTC’s for the trans in the pcm. I cannot edit anything in the BCM though.

If you have any more questions, let me know.

Mike Miller

Milzy Motorsports


So.... if there are any auto trans settings in the BCM, he can't touch them.... but for 225 + shipping + core, I couldn't find a price on the other place that was recommended... DHP I think it was









Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Tuesday, September 19, 2006 1:59 PM
Funny, Mike felt the need not to respond to me on that. If you read through the post, you'll see me talking about it.





Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Tuesday, September 19, 2006 3:15 PM
I figured if I had mentioned that it was for an engine swap to a J, I might not have received an answer... thats why I went w/ the manual tranny to the N-Body swap.











Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Wednesday, September 20, 2006 2:24 AM
Hmm...... good call.





Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Sunday, September 24, 2006 6:40 PM
Maybe all the rest of you 3400 guys have run out of posts and are waiting for October? This post has been dead for a bit now. I'm kinda suprised.

My cousin came over tonight and showed me his new 01 GAGT with the 3400. I made fun of him and called it weak and stuff, and he informed me that he's never rode in the 3400 Cav yet. Hmmmm.......... so we went out and terrorized the town.

I raced some dude in a Civic EX that my buddy works with. I shifted to third then he took off. I put her back into 2nd and started making a massively quick gain on him. Popped down the clutch, slammed the shifter which made an awful gridning noise and let out and apparently.... I'd shoved it into 1st gear. It's been giving me problems with shifting it hard anyways, and after that, I dont think the tranny really likes it. Now i'm grinding pretty bad any time I go to shift into 2nd with any RPM on the engine (why not first, i'm suprised at, but oh well)

So, now I should investegate the possibility of the T550 or 282 swap that they 2.4 guys like to do. Should work the same way with mine, cept i'll be getting the donor from a 3.1.

I've made notice that in my bank account that I use for my automobile funding, I now have more than enough money to pick up the MS-II that i'm wanting so badly. But I know it's getting cold out again, so I'll probably just wait on it to start snowing, and keep saving some money. (interest is always good anyways). Then I'll wait til I get some income tax back... which hopefully should be VERY nice this year. And then I shall have all my Gauges, ECU (probably get MegaView with it and stuff it in my new cluster) and maybe some other thing. I dunno for sure though yet. We'll see. But a new tranny will most likely DEFINATELY be in my near future.





Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Sunday, September 24, 2006 7:26 PM
I'd look into the gear ratios before swapping.
I don't know, but I'd guess the 4 banger tranny more than likely has a steeper final drive ratio.
Wouldn't want to give up any of that throw-your-ass-in-the-seat torque!






Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Sunday, September 24, 2006 7:42 PM
Yeah, I could always rebuild or something. LSD is gonna be a personal requirement one way or the other. At least the car moves and does fine, just grinds pretty bad into 2nd, something to just get worse.

Traction is an issue too. Better tires would surely help this. I got spanked on by a Camaro, cuz i raced from a dig.





Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Sunday, October 01, 2006 8:47 AM
SHOoff wrote:Yeah, I could always rebuild or something. LSD is gonna be a personal requirement one way or the other. At least the car moves and does fine, just grinds pretty bad into 2nd, something to just get worse.

Traction is an issue too. Better tires would surely help this. I got spanked on by a Camaro, cuz i raced from a dig.

If you really want to have fun, drop the $5K on a set of custom gears for it.





Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Sunday, October 01, 2006 6:47 PM
Quiklilcav wrote:
SHOoff wrote:Yeah, I could always rebuild or something. LSD is gonna be a personal requirement one way or the other. At least the car moves and does fine, just grinds pretty bad into 2nd, something to just get worse.

Traction is an issue too. Better tires would surely help this. I got spanked on by a Camaro, cuz i raced from a dig.

If you really want to have fun, drop the $5K on a set of custom gears for it.


Ehh... i'm lucky to spend $5K on an entire car. LOL Seriously, I fought like hell with the dealership until I got my DD for 4800 out the door. I had to break down and tell them that I would take care of fixing the air bags (and never have). But I got it.





Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Friday, October 06, 2006 4:32 AM
Lil update from me.

For now, the 3400 cav is replacing the GTP (which is my DD) due to an engine fire that happened wednesday evening. Cav doesnt do too good on wet roads, which is quite annoying. But, it gets me to work, which pays the bills.






Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Sunday, October 15, 2006 7:20 AM
You know, I was just thinking about something. In all of the research we have all collectively done regarding this swap, has anyone considered swapping in the N-Body subframe? I'm wondering if it would bolt up, because the N and J bodies from the mid 90's to most recent have almost identical engine bays, body structures, and front suspensions. If this would work, there would be no need for the custom torque arm mount.

Just brainstorming...Figured I'd throw it out there for discussion.






Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Sunday, October 15, 2006 2:26 PM
Quote:

If this would work, there would be no need for the custom torque arm mount.


I think I missed something about that mount...









Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Sunday, October 15, 2006 5:25 PM
Kardain wrote:
quiklilcav wrote:If this would work, there would be no need for the custom torque arm mount.


I think I missed something about that mount...

If you put the V6 engine in the J with the factory lower mount (torque mount), it does not line up.
This should answer all of your questions regarding the lower mount.






Re: some progress info on the V6 swap
Sunday, October 15, 2006 5:31 PM
Ah... the modded lower mount. *phew* I thought I was going to have to fab up another mount









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