Methanol is like American Express; "
I don't leave home without it "
Been running Meth for 3 years straight and I have been through at least 50 gallons of my own 50/50 mix. Absolutely love it !!!! I run it every day. My setup drops the A/Rs 1 whole point (i.e. 12.5:1 w/o 11.5:1 w/ ). I monitor knock constantly with a warning light on my Aeroforce gauges just in case but failure has never been a factor. Timing is where it's at and Meth allows for its advancement. Anything I advance it the knock retard will pull back out if need be. I have my knock retard ramping setup for instant which takes care of the pull your foot off the gas scenario.
Meth all the way, good stuff, especially for us who are stuck with poopy 91 octane. FAR cheaper solution to 104 Sunoco at nearly $9 per gallon here
ASE Master Certified Automotive Technician
alright, really old post, but stupid to make a new post when this has a lot of good info in it..and you all have something worthy to add...
so yeah, meth, its a hell of a drug!..(for my car)...
I have the opportunity to get a devils own stage 2 setup for $200-250 from a friend (working on the negotiations...)
My mods:
M62 (stock)
42.5(stage2) injectors
3.0" smooth flow pulley
racetronix wbody fuel pump/harness
ZZP S3 h/e
option B/dual pass endplate
stock internals
ive got the current new mods (or obtaining them this week):
- stage 2 JBP cams
- 2.8" smooth flow pulley
- LS1/Vortec throttle body/adapter
- stage 2 devils own meth setup (universal with the boost switch, not the controller)
2 questions.
will the meth be beneficial to me on stock internals, and should i even run it?
can i run the 1 wire, 2.5 bar map sensor controller or the built in 30psi boost port? or am i required to run the manual boost switch with the L61 setup? I have the 2.5bar map sensor wired into my supercharged setup when installed.
question 3 (i cheated), can I run the meth injection into the throttle body adapter instead of tapping my manifold (LSJ) or intake piping?
My goal is cooling, but I also want to safely add a bit more hp to the wheels. i feel with my setup above I will be easily pushing the stock internals to their demise...which is okay...if its borderline then I can live with that for a few months and rebuild with upgraded parts (and upgraded boost options
heh heh). But for now, i want to maximize my track times and street runs. Ive already handled a few Z's, n/a V8's, a stage 2 Roush Mustang on 13psi supercharger, 17psi supercharged Jbody, 10psi turbocharged 02 Ecotech cavy (whos now at 11 or 12psi and i havent re-raced him), etc. But Im wanting MOAAAAR POWWWA!!! Should I or can I do this stage 2 universal devils own setup?
thanks guys
04 Cav. 2dr. 5spd. My DD. 'Nuff said.
For us supercharged guys dont bother with a progressive controller. Go with a boost switch. That solves problem 1
Yes meth for any car is great and I cant wait to get mine done!
Either or for where you tap it in.
Most say do it pre blower in like the intake piping somewhere.
Cool thanks. This kit includes the switch that you have to wire in, not a single wire boost controller or vacuum line connection, but the actual switch. I guess you still can set the psi to when it sprays or does the switch have to be pressed when you want to use meth this method?
04 Cav. 2dr. 5spd. My DD. 'Nuff said.
Philly D wrote:http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.com/p129/AIS-1-25-PSI-Adjustable-Boost-Pressure-Switches/product_info.html
It gets a signal line from your intake manifold an is adjustable. So just adjust it to your desired range and your set. No pressing ala' nos lol
Agreed on the pressure switch. The progressive is not needed for a blower. I have the AIS one Phil linked.
I installed the ais kit a couple weeks ago an so far love it, I tapped off the vacum line for the fpr an it works perfect
z28guy(KGM BEOTCH)
only problem is currrently I only run 8psi..so that switch would basically ensure Id never run out of Meth haha....
but with the 2.8" pulley, I should be hitting the 10psi mark, at least.
Ive been trying to find install pics and some install to the front fenders (pump on one side, tank on the other) and some in the trunk. I like the idea of building a quality box that houses the tank, switch, and pump right in the box. I guess I might change my mind if I pull the driver fender off and check that out...removing the factory intake housing freed up a lot of room if I recall, and the passenger side behind the headlight has a lot of empty space too. I need to look.
04 Cav. 2dr. 5spd. My DD. 'Nuff said.
8 psi really? We see 11.5 psi on,mine with 3.1 pulley, not sure how much with my 2.8 havent driven it yet lol
z28guy(KGM BEOTCH)
The switch is adjustable though
z28guy(KGM BEOTCH)
Yeah 8 psi seems way low. I was seeing 12ish on a 3.1. I know psi is relative and changes with things like spacers, but not that much.
But like Sam said, the boost pressure switch is adjustable. You can set it to come on at whatever psi you want, then its own for the duration. The progressive is overkill on a m62 because of how it ramps...we don't have a long enough span to really need it. Let's say you make 10 psi, and set the controller for 5. So it'll kick on at 5 psi then slowly ramp up to 100%...which if you're maxing out at 8, then whats the point? Our psi range is minimal that's its practically the same as a pressure switch. You could also set it to the FULL setting and it will act like a pressure switch...but to me, I'd rather have it kick on and stay on for the duration - especially considering the amount of heat the blower makes, the cooling advantage even at a lower boost pressure will be beneficial.
http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.com/Water-Injection-Tanks/c39/index.html
Im getting the 3gal in trunk tank. Its great and the pump hides up in it.
There isnt much point to running a progressive switch since our boost is pretty much instant. There really isnt much ramp. Couple that with what Evil said and there is your reasoning. Set the switch for the desired pressure you want your meth come on at and bobs your uncle.
Id be looking into why your boost is so low. I know that its all relative and such and mods will make it lower but your car seems to be a anomaly with how low it is. Id look at maybe pulling off the oem blower spacer and seeing what it is after that. I have a feeling
My friend and I (he has an 06 SS/SC and has built ecos plenty of times) tested the psi levels a few times.
We even hooked up additional boost gauges and drove around, it hits 8 exactly every time.
someone before in one of my posts asking about the lower pressure, was saying exhaust could have a lot to do with it.
Im running the larger primary LSJ pace setter header, hi-flow spun cat, a decent sized resonator into a Boral Pro muffler, all 2.5" exhaust.
that in conjunction with the phenolic spacers seemed to be a reasonable conclusion. Now when I removed the head to IM spacer because I was having issues with bolts, it seemed to have increased maybe .5psi, but almost not even noticable.
I have run 8psi since the build and run Austins 17psi setup (give or take some, he was not running a heat exchanger at the time since his pump was out), plenty of turbos, and even recently some supercharged mustangs.
So Im not exactly LOSING a lot of power and if I am supposed to have more, then it'll only make me faster, but its seems on par with other sc jbodies. Now i do run very rich but thats the tune. which im going to have fixed with these near future modifications.
As far as the controller, i see the point in not needing the progressive controller. I just notice they have the built in indicators for low fluid or a pump thats gone out, which to me are almost a necessity. Has anyone hooked up similar indicators seperatly from the manual boost switch?
Phily D, yeah i saw those tanks. but the kits available to me already have tanks, so unless i sell and rebuy i need to just adapt what Ive got (or will get).
My 8psi was discussed in my ecotec forum build i beleive and in here a few times, and it sounded like a lot of ppl came to the agreement that it was my modificaton combination that simply added up to be a more efficient use of the blower and creating the same power on less boost. I dont know, but trust me, id sure like to know if im missing 50% of my potential power! I realy just wish I could afford a shop do a proper dyno-tune and tune the car live in an hour or two and not rely on email tuning. It just takes so long between tunes and its never really been 'right'. I run so pig rich i get like 10mpg if i use boost lol.
04 Cav. 2dr. 5spd. My DD. 'Nuff said.
I dunno man, but I think you're tune is probably the issue. I'm running a similar setup to you as far as exhaust, spacers, etc and shown much higher psi. As said, a 3.0" pulley even with spacers, exhaust and so on should net you way more than 8 psi...I'm hitting around 12-12.5 on a 3.1" with a spacer and 2.5" exhaust.
And if you're already running rich, I'd honestly get that straightened out before tuning for meth...when you tune for meth you need to pull fuel to compensate, and you're already running richer than you should...there's a problem somewhere and you definitely want to get that straightened out before adding more on.
Did you have the tune adjusted after installing the Racetronix? Honestly I'd give Trifecta the boot...I don't think remote tuning is all the liable to begin with, and the more mods you start throwing on, the more complicated it gets to keep the tuning dialed in properly.
Anyway, back to on topic of the thread, lol...run a pressure switch and if you want to monitor things, get a flow gauge. The kits usually also have an LED light that will illuminate when your pump is running. But honestly though, there's some issue going on restricting your power, whether it be mechanical or tune related...fix that before worrying about meth
Im going to get a new data log done today (Monday) some time. Ill let the tuner know to check it out.
Ive ordered my 2.8" pulley, meth kit, have the cams, and now all i need is the springs. So Ill wait on installing or at least hooking up the meth until i get it properly tuned.
I wonder if I just pop on the 2.8" pulley and stage 2 belt (that will finally fit hopefully)...if it'll still remain at 8psi. if so, somethings definitely up. The tune cant TELL the psi to remain at a specific level right? I mean the psi is based on many factors and will be slightly different for each setup, or so i thought.
04 Cav. 2dr. 5spd. My DD. 'Nuff said.
Quote:
As far as the controller, i see the point in not needing the progressive controller. I just notice they have the built in indicators for low fluid or a pump thats gone out, which to me are almost a necessity. Has anyone hooked up similar indicators seperatly from the manual boost switch?
I have. I ran a low level indicator led using an ELS-1100 fluid level sensor from gems sensors.
Here. It's really easy to do. I don't have any kind of indicator if the pump goes out though. I just have one led that comes on when the injection activates and one that comes on when my fluid gets below a certain point.
nice find. Ill have to see what I can dig up. I think having one of the pump being functional is pretty important, so that and fluid level are my two main ones. Having one that detects when its spraying and when its off would be a bonus..
I guess as far as the pump going out, it would be similar to my intercooler pump. I put in a manual 'touch' cut off switch, blue its on, red its off. If its not working or loses power, it goes red. Only down side is i put the switch on the bottom of the dash area so when i reach for a drink my knuckle sometimes turns off my pump lol...but I just turn it back on.
04 Cav. 2dr. 5spd. My DD. 'Nuff said.
so wtf is the crap i keep hearing about meth destroying the supercharger rotors or some @!#$?
I choose the technology built for land speed records... not the technology built to save on emissions and gas mileage.
It supposedly takes the epoxy coating off of them.
1994 Saturn SL2 Home Coming Edition: backup car
2002 Chevy Cavalier LS Sport Coupe: In a Junk Yard
1995 Mazda Miata R-package Class=STR
Sponsored by:
Kronos Performance
WPI Class of '12 Mechanical Engineering
WPI SAE Risk and Sustainability Management Officer
-Z Yaaaa- wrote:so wtf is the crap i keep hearing about meth destroying the supercharger rotors or some @!#$?
I haven't heard it anywhere, but was wondering the same..
"In Oldskool we trust"
that was my biggest concern and reasoning for possibly tapping the Intake Manifold. But its WAY easier to just do the intake or throttle body spacer....so I am not sure.
Im wondering if Eaton or a well known manufacturer has information on this 'myth'.
Heres a link I found doing a quick search online, Ill look a bit more or check out Eatons forums...
http://rivperformance.editboard.com/t8285-teflon-coating-is-coming-off-the-supercharger-rotors
04 Cav. 2dr. 5spd. My DD. 'Nuff said.
Here's Powell's opinion
"Long term the rotor coating on M62 will be removed by pre blower meth, and the bypass valve shaft will be damaged and eventually seize, from what I have seen from meth; A car we built in 2007 with meth, and run like that until this month, well, I had to change the blower and remove meth to avoid a repeat of the same issue."
1994 Saturn SL2 Home Coming Edition: backup car
2002 Chevy Cavalier LS Sport Coupe: In a Junk Yard
1995 Mazda Miata R-package Class=STR
Sponsored by:
Kronos Performance
WPI Class of '12 Mechanical Engineering
WPI SAE Risk and Sustainability Management Officer
thats okay...by the time my next upgrades are due, ill need to upgrade the motor and blower any how!
04 Cav. 2dr. 5spd. My DD. 'Nuff said.
apparently stiegemeyer removes the coating when they do their porting treatment anyway so i guess im good lol
I choose the technology built for land speed records... not the technology built to save on emissions and gas mileage.
It can eat the Teflon coating on the latter GEN III and GEN IV blowers.
The non economy engine superchargers don't have to worry about this.
Chris
'02 Z-24 Supercharged
13.7 @102.45 MPH Third Place, 2007 GMSC Bash SOLD AS OF 01MAR08
