Time to upgrade performance - Boost Forum

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Time to upgrade performance
Thursday, February 28, 2013 9:17 PM
Hey yall, I have an 04 ecotec with a GM supercharger kit and intercooled. Full exhaust, short throat, and a battery relocation. Ant recommendations on my next mod to increase HP? I wanna do a complete Tein suspension kit which will be helpful but not add HP's. Any ideas guys? Stock internals but well taken care of with 130,000 miles. I was thinking smaller pulley, belt, and a tune?
Thank guyss

Re: Time to upgrade performance
Thursday, February 28, 2013 10:44 PM
Pulley, belt, injectors, and tune is a good place to start.



Re: Time to upgrade performance
Saturday, March 02, 2013 9:27 AM
Ok cool Tinkles, So I did some research and discovered that I can safely run a 3.0 pulley and with my current stock belt. The information I found on the injector size was confusing. From what I understand, I should run #60 injectors. I can also stay on my same GM tune also. Is this information correct Mr. Tinkles?
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Saturday, March 02, 2013 10:56 AM
If your on the Gm reflash and not going to get tuned you can only run the injectors you currently have in your car now.

But if you are going to get tuned then you can run a larger injector so your at a lower duty cycle.
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Saturday, March 02, 2013 9:33 PM
No.

The GM Crapflash is only good for the 36# injectors that come in the kit. Anything larger requires a custom retune. 60# injectors should be fine for a 2.9" pulley and water/meth.

As for staying on the Crapflash. The 3.1" pulley is safe, i have seen quite a few people say that they have leaned out in the higher RPMs with a 3.0. But in my experience the 3.1" is the best for the Crapflash.

60# injectors, a Racetronix fuel pump, 2.8" pulley, better intercooler system, water/meth, and a GOOD tune(very very important) should make for a fun car. 60s and the pump will leave you with plenty of room for future upgrades(they keep up with my Harrop).



Re: Time to upgrade performance
Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:51 PM
hahaha he called him Mr. Tinkles.....


04 Cav. 2dr. 5spd. My DD. 'Nuff said.
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Sunday, March 03, 2013 8:34 PM
blu04DD wrote:

hahaha he called him Mr. Tinkles.....


How safe is really safe with the 3.1 on the reflash. Anyone know the duty cycle of the injectors? And if upgraded to the racetronix pump would that lower the duty cycle?



Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 5:39 AM
^^Im curious as well..

Im on the reflash and just picked up a racetronics pump and wire harness yesterday.
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 7:09 AM
The racetronix did not change my duty cycle or AFRs at all on the stock setup (stock injectors, stock pulley). I'm not using the harness. We tested it with HPT and found literally no difference between it and the stock pump in terms of duty cycle or AFR. It makes sense because how could you deliver more fuel with a better pump if you didn't change the regulator at all? The only way it would help is if the stock pump is completely maxed and not putting out enough fuel to hold pressure, but I'm sure that's not the case on the stock setup.

As for duty cycle, I'll give you my experiences. My rpm limit was moved to 7000 but I have not been able to go that high on stock injectors and STOCK pulley. Right around 6400-6500 I'm completely out of fuel even with the racetronix pump; the PCM is calling for 130% duty cycle. Now I'm fine at the stock redline which is somewhere around 6250 correct? So with a racetronix pump, stock injectors, 3.1, I think you're just about pushing it to absolute limit and if the conditions are right you could lean out by redline.

If you're sticking with the reflash(whether forced or by choice) I think the only way to do it safely is with the racetronix pump and an adjustable fuel pressure regulator. That's what Evofire is running and he's had good success. It'll take you a while to get it dialed in just right but I don't see any other options to be totally safe. Just my .02.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Monday, March 04, 2013 7:11 AM


"In Oldskool we trust"
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 8:25 AM
Thanks, I'll stick with what I got...the GM reflash has been good to me (super rich but no other problems like I've read). I was just curious about the duty cycle being helped with a better pump because of what I read with Tinkles and his 60# injectors going from a 80+% duty to 60%? or around there from switching....of course those are much bigger though



Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 9:11 AM
The funny thing is that Tinkles and I have the same tuner. He seemed to think that the pump would help me too but it didn't...at all. I'm wondering if Tinkles really was maxing out the factory pump with 60's and a tvs though. That would be the only situation I can think of that just a pump could improve duty cycle like that.

On the other side of the coin for you, I know a guy up here that lives at sea level and runs a 3.1 on the reflash with no fueling mods. He hasn't had any trouble but his wideband hasn't been working for a long time so there's really no way to know if he's leaning out or not. I guess a motor that isn't blown is proof it's not too bad. Although, he did recently blow a head gasket. I'm sure he's not the only one running a 3.1 on the reflash without swiss cheesed pistons. But that's why I think it really comes down to personal choice. If it were ME, I wouldn't take the chance. Heck, I'm worried about putting on my 3.1 with 42s!


"In Oldskool we trust"

Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 9:57 AM
I'm sure he was, that TVS pushes a lot more air maxing out the pump and his pump may have been on it's way out too.

Ya I'm not gonna take the chance and push it. Plan is to one day have a built trans from IPT, drop to a 2.9, and put in 60's with a racetronix pump tuned by P&P, but that's a ways away.
No way I'd run a boosted car without a wideband...his mantra must be what you don't know won't hurt you haha



Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 10:42 AM
Luke C wrote:

No way I'd run a boosted car without a wideband...his mantra must be what you don't know won't hurt you haha

Right? lol. He's been pretty busy with life lately so I don't think he even drives it that much anymore. I'm not sure he's even fixed the head gasket yet (been a few months).


"In Oldskool we trust"
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 4:33 PM
Luke C wrote:

Thanks, I'll stick with what I got...the GM reflash has been good to me (super rich but no other problems like I've read). I was just curious about the duty cycle being helped with a better pump because of what I read with Tinkles and his 60# injectors going from a 80+% duty to 60%? or around there from switching....of course those are much bigger though


Keep in mind the reflash makes you have a @!#$ ton of knock. I dont know what your getting but I get around 7.9deg of knock retard on stock pulley on the reflash. Its not good.

Im to the point where ill be buying Hptuners and learning.

I believe the problem lies in when pe mode is activated. Unless you floor it you wont activate pe mode. So while watching my wideband and boost gauge and giving it gas the PCM will be still trying to give 14.7 afr when im in boost. So I get a spike in knock up to 7.9* followed by the recovery. Its pig rich once pe is enabled but by then its to late.

Just a theory but with all the gauges I have I can monitor a fair bit.
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 5:08 PM
That's interesting your registering that much knock. I have the aeroforce interceptor well and never register knock and if any it'll only be less than 0.2* Even if I smash the gas or roll on into boost I'll always end up with an afr of around 10. Seems like even more the crapflash is hit or miss.

Dave



Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 5:42 PM
Crazy...

Maybe its just my car then.

I have a buddy with a reflash PCM and I may see if I can borrow his for a bit and see if mine is just crap or something.

That or I have some sort of mechanical issue but I have no clue what it could be. I have good fuel pressure, 3787 spark plugs gapped at .033"

Mines fine and I get zero knock till about 5 psi. But at 5psi my car is still at 14.7 afr. I have to floor it to get the 10 afr.

Im at sea level as well.....wonder if that makes much difference.
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 6:23 PM
I'm at sea level too but never had trouble with knock or afr on the reflash. When I even got past half throttle it was FAT. Always dropped to 10 or 11 almost immediately in boost. It sounds like somethings off with your setup.


"In Oldskool we trust"
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 6:25 PM
Could very well be the car or just a stupid flash. No harm in trying another flash tho. Idk how much of a difference elevation makes, I'm not to high above sea level in northern Illinois. Where did you get your pcm flashed at? I sent mine to exatorq. It could be a bit of a stretch but you could be getting false knock. You can check your plugs for discoloration to find signs of knock. Might just want to check out this thread over on an evo forum i found. Link

Dave



Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 6:58 PM
Well we kinda derailed the OP's thread...sorry man..

Mine is a GM reflash from about 2005.

I thought about false knock as well... Ill find it one of thee days. Makes me wonder more now that I know you guys didnt get any.

FML...lol
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 8:47 PM
So from what I've been reading, I can run a 3.1 with my current tune and injectors. So all I need to obtain is a 3.1 pulley and a stage 2 cobalt SS belt and slice a rivet off. Is this making sense to anyone? I hope so. lol
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Monday, March 04, 2013 9:07 PM
You van run a 3.1 but you'll be maxing out the injectors and probably lean out in the top end. Safest way to do it if you're gonna stay on those injectors is to bump fuel pressure and with a racetronix like Another user has




Re: Time to upgrade performance
Tuesday, March 05, 2013 5:20 AM
You dont need the stage 2 belt...stock will work just fine.
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Tuesday, March 05, 2013 5:35 AM
As said, stock belt will work. Like mentioned above, do it at your own risk. Most people don't have trouble but it's not ideal by any means. The reflash is NOT tuned for this and the injectors don't have much room for growth.

Philly if you want I can put my reflash back in and try to take some video of AFR's for you. Might have to wait until the weekend but I don't mind if it helps you out.


"In Oldskool we trust"
Re: Time to upgrade performance
Tuesday, March 05, 2013 6:22 AM
I could chip in with a video also...i should be getting my interceptor gauge this week and once its installed i'll take a vid of that and the wideband



Re: Time to upgrade performance
Tuesday, March 05, 2013 3:49 PM
That would rock you guys...

So sorry OP for totally hi jacking your thread.

Moved to pm's!
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