L61 M62 timing really low - Boost Forum

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L61 M62 timing really low
Sunday, May 05, 2013 12:58 PM
I have a cavalier s/c with 2.9, cobalt intercooler, cobra intercooler and ls1 TB and I have to run at 3 degrees of advance at 6400 in hptuner to not knocks....

My brother have the GMPP s/c kit with gm reflash and no intercooler (basic setup) with stock pulley 3.35 and I'm not able to beat him!!

And I think 3 degrees is too low but if I go higher...knocks knocks

Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Sunday, May 05, 2013 1:02 PM
I have 42lb injectors and not pass the 100% duty cycle
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Sunday, May 05, 2013 1:07 PM
3 is way way to low.

You should be around 16 or so without meth.
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Sunday, May 05, 2013 1:57 PM
Yeah my base for startup was 15 and the wheels spin crazy in seconde gear but knocks in hpt scanner...

Lower degrees at 3 of advance and stock knocking...at 5 it knocks

A loose timing chain can be reading into knock in hpt? Or holes in the roads??

I'm lost because a gmpp give 205bhp to the crank and my setup would be around 230 to 260 crank hp
My Bro have around 8 to 10psi on the guage and I have 14... Suppose to be the day and night differance

And is IAT without intercooler is 20 degrees higher and more than me.
I never be higher than 68 IAT.

My AFR between 10 to 11 max and my brother too

What can cause knocks like that
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Sunday, May 05, 2013 2:07 PM
being too rich can cause knock on the eco from what ive been told.

Plugged cat or exhaust can cause knock.
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Sunday, May 05, 2013 2:53 PM
The GMPP Reflash of my brother is set to 10.5 AFR

I've try 12.5 to 10.0 AFR for same result

I have no Cat, 4-2-1 headers with 2.5'' downpipe and full exhaust 2.5''
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Sunday, May 05, 2013 4:39 PM
The reflash is super rich, don't go by that. If you're custom tuning aim for something more like 11-11.5. What plugs are you running? Stock harness an knock sensor? Maybe try and change out the knock sensor. Can you log knock retard?



"In Oldskool we trust"
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Sunday, May 05, 2013 6:10 PM
NGK 1 step colder than stock and gap 35...and I've try gap 25 to 40 and nothing change my knocking problem

All harness except injectors is stock

I am on my cellular but I will post you what I'm suppose to have in spark table and my actual spark table
And some hpt logs
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Sunday, May 05, 2013 6:46 PM
3 degrees is really low. I have found really rich afr can cause knock on the Ecotec. I usually aim for 11.7-12.2 on a Ecotec.

You can also try detuning the knock sensor.



FU Tuning



Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Monday, May 06, 2013 3:25 AM
Detune the knock sensor? I have a spare motor and a can swap de knock sensor for test but detune the knock sensor I don't understand what's it means and how doing it.

Second: stiff engin mounts can cause a suffisant vibration at high rpm for the sensor?
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Monday, May 06, 2013 5:34 AM
I think your dealing with a mechanical issue. Whether its a false knock from something vibrating or your actually knocking.

May be best to upload your tune and maybe someone can see whats going on.

Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Monday, May 06, 2013 9:01 AM
I've scanned the GMPP and the timing at 6500 still around 18

You are good with your 15 to 16 degrees

But the knock sensor on the GMPP is not supported and cannot see if it knocks

I've put back my table to 15 at 6400 on mine cavalier and knocks... Probably mecanical prob
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Monday, May 06, 2013 4:18 PM
here's my spark table in PE mode and my log




Don't look at the beautiful pink color haha this is the windows 8 of my girlfriend
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Monday, May 06, 2013 4:21 PM
My AFR still 12.77because not pluggued (forgot)
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Monday, May 06, 2013 6:54 PM
Looks like your getting 11.5 degrees of timing.



FU Tuning



Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Tuesday, May 07, 2013 12:16 AM
Addicted to meth wrote:

Looks like your getting 11.5 degrees of timing.
yes this is 15 degrees - iat spark and - knock retard attack?? =11.5

But anyway 15 or 11.5 not suppose to knock like this?
Duty cycle below 100%
My AFR around 11
IAT 61 not too high??

No methanol in my car
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Tuesday, May 07, 2013 10:11 AM
And I have try to 10 degrees and had knocks again than drop it and drop it and stop knocking a 3 degrees in my 75 kpa at 6400 rpm cell...
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Tuesday, May 07, 2013 10:12 AM
Only 91 gas here.. No 93
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Tuesday, May 07, 2013 10:30 AM
There was another member having this problem in BC. My only suggestion is to find some better fuel, even if you have to cross the border, and do some more logging.



"In Oldskool we trust"
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Tuesday, May 07, 2013 12:43 PM
Match your 75 and 80 Kia columns.



FU Tuning



Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Friday, May 10, 2013 5:07 AM
The IAT of 61*C in F is about 150*. That's pretty high. Also, it looks like the KR is RPM dependent - in the lower RPMs it does fine, and at a certain rpm, the KR hits. Is that what you are noticing in the logs?

If this is a 2.5 bar set up, I would zero out the -4 and 20* IAT modifier rows, instead of +1. It has something to do with the 2.5bar fake, but the IAT modifier has a huge effect on the commanded advance.




Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Friday, May 10, 2013 6:32 PM
I probably found out.....ridiculous..

last year my setup was not finish and I put my plug in the GMPP of my Bro..

So this winter I forgot this and this month I started with in mind: I have my one step colder in..

Today I have buy LTR7IX and put it inside and yess I really had stock AC delco in my car haha

Tomorrow I will log again my car!

But tonight to back home it seams to run like a charm
Much better 5000 to 7000 probably because ECM not pull knock retard
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Monday, May 13, 2013 6:06 AM
Didn't solve my problem... But my engin run a bit cooler

All people talk about 15 to 16 degrees but this is with low compression piston or stock internal?

I have all stock internal
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Monday, May 13, 2013 7:19 AM
I'm seeing 18 degrees of timing on a totally stock motor, stock endplate, ZZP S3 heat exchanger, and cobalt filler neck.



"In Oldskool we trust"
Re: L61 M62 timing really low
Monday, May 13, 2013 9:18 AM
Yeah my Bro with SC reflash hit 18 at 6500rpm around 9 to 10 psi of boost and no intercooler (stock gmpp)
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