Bill Hahn Jr. wrote:Fireshroom wrote:just to chime in on this, The Subaru will most likely be much more reliable then the Cobalt, and would most likely last much longer(depending on maintenance of course). No offense to the Eco but the 2.0l H4 has been proven reliability record. Also a + is that the Subaru will hold better resale value then the cobalt SS. Again all this is my 2 cents.
I think your 2 cents is a copy of someone else's 2 cents, for while this long-standing legend of poor reliability for domestic products has been turned back in recent years, those with an axe to grind continue to perpetuate it. Why, I have no idea. One would think American people would take pride in American product. But today's tabloid mentality says it's more fun to laugh at others' misfortunes than to be a careful, patriotic consumer. I see it as an unraveling of the fabric that made this nation great.
Not saying you are the axe-grinder...just that you are parroting one 
I did not copy someone else opinion i gave mine based on what i have seen many years growing up both in the USA and abroad, most American vehicles are looked upon very negatively overseas and in america. This belief of poor reliability is starting to very slowly change. The reliability legend isn't a legend. Up until recent years american cars produced by General Motors were not on par with most of the world.
Also you haven't responded to the fact that none-domestic vehicles retains a far superior value depreciation then domestic ones. There is a reason to for this. The legend you call "Cheaply" made cars.
Also a quick search of
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov or Recalls.gov shows x100 higher rate of complaints filed + if you look at recalls for previous year models(like a 98 Pontiac Sunfire for example) you will see the recalls are far higher for any domestic vehicle then import.
05 Cobalt ODI Home » Search Complaints » Results List = 643
05 WRX ODI Home » Search Complaints » Results List = 8
same trend goes for recalls etc.
Now i get ready to be knocked by people for axe-grinding american cars...(even though i just bought a new motor for my sunfire
Bill i wish you made Turbo kits for LD9's as well.
I am sure there would be a market for it.
I'm glad you were able to help me illustrate that the Legend continues to persist mostly in the minds of those who would, for some hard-to-understand reason, perpetuate it. You are correct...it is indeed a flawed and obsolete point of view where the new cars are concerned. As this thread addresses new cars, that's what is pertinent, and in new-car quality, Domestics have achieved an even keel with Imports.
I didn't respond to resale value because I have no counterpoint to it. Please note that I only take on battles I think I can win
But since you are insisting upon some interaction regarding this, I'll offer that The Olde Legend of Poor Quality does indeed haunt it as well, and will also likely linger on longer than is fair to those who truly believe in and buy American.
Ah, LD9. My long-lost love. So many cars, so little time!
Bill Hahn Jr.
Hahn RaceCraft
World's Quickest and Fastest Street J-Bodies
Turbocharging GM FWD's since 1988
www.turbosystem.com
Bill Hahn Jr. wrote:
Ah, LD9. My long-lost love. So many cars, so little time!
You can spend a month or two on R&D for a ld9.... Since you have done this before its all sitting there in front of you i am sure.
Ah, but a month or two of our R&D has to result in much higher return than we think this application would bring. We'd have to sell at least a quarter-million dollars worth of these systems to justify that R&D investment. It's not that the LD9 market is non-existent...it's just that its size is better suited to smaller companies and individual enthusiasts.
As a point of comparison, we've been selling Cobalt TC components for over a year now. In that time, we've produced and sold literally thousands of parts for this fun new Chevy. As much as we'd like to cover every application we're capable of, we have to choose our bullets carefully. At the end of the day, this is a fun business, but...it's still a business. If it doesn't turn a reasonable profit, its reason for being ceases to exist.
Bill Hahn Jr.
Hahn RaceCraft
World's Quickest and Fastest Street J-Bodies
Turbocharging GM FWD's since 1988
www.turbosystem.com
Bill Hahn Jr. wrote:Ah, but a month or two of our R&D has to result in much higher return than we think this application would bring. We'd have to sell at least a quarter-million dollars worth of these systems to justify that R&D investment. It's not that the LD9 market is non-existent...it's just that its size is better suited to smaller companies and individual enthusiasts.
As a point of comparison, we've been selling Cobalt TC components for over a year now. In that time, we've produced and sold literally thousands of parts for this fun new Chevy. As much as we'd like to cover every application we're capable of, we have to choose our bullets carefully. At the end of the day, this is a fun business, but...it's still a business. If it doesn't turn a reasonable profit, its reason for being ceases to exist.
what ended up happening with the SEMA Kit? did it get smashed with the car? or did you shelf it?
It got parceled out over time...since we weren't taking it to market, we didn't make it a point to keep around.
Fact is, if I did it again, I'd take a different approach anyway...a lot has changed in the ten years since we did that one
Bill Hahn Jr.
Hahn RaceCraft
World's Quickest and Fastest Street J-Bodies
Turbocharging GM FWD's since 1988
www.turbosystem.com
[quote=97cavie24ls(™)]
Mr.Goodwrench-G.T. wrote:Bill Hahn Jr. wrote:Here...let's be fair. Let ME try this approach.
When a WRX is capable of remotely doing and sounding anything like this, then I would sway Subie. But hands down, SS/TC any day.
Schaffer, good luck on what you decide... and don't forget to take pics.
gotta side with bill on this 1 , you opened the can of spam first , lol
Naaa, I beg to differ on that.
I still stand, a street Cobalt's 4cyl will never sound as ferocious as the WRX. Best of all, you need less than $1K to open up the exhaust to listen to that boxer rumble. Last but not least, when you want to have fun, it is nice that you have the ability to power oversteer at will, instead being plagued with FWD understeer.
Let him show all the tube chassis drag racing Cobalts he wants, after he is changing engines after 20 miles of use, I will be at the gas station refilling up the WRX.
>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----
this thread needed a SS/TC pic
it's a fun car to drive. i enjoy it when i can and get great mileage.
as Joe said, the seats are GREAT. im confirmation that they are fat kid friendly. lol
once the money is there for exhaust, intake and tune then i'll be more happy with it
go test drive one. i let all my friends handle Cortana and they love her.
it just sounds like a car you will be happy with too.
something you sound like your looking for
14.4 @ 101 Bradenton Motorsports Park 11/22/08
JLAudioCavalier wrote:Tinkles wrote:You and I both live in PA where we get a good amount of snow. Why get a SS/TC that you can only have fun in on nice days? I'd rather get a WRX and have fun year round. A WRX is going to be my next car once my cav is paid off.
Only have fun on nice days? If you can't drive a FWD car in the snow, you might wanna turn in your keys.
And your balls.
Even a RWD one for that matter.
i drove my rwd truck with a/t tires on it all over in the snow...8 inches the one day and i just kept pushing..mind you i live at the top a hill thats a mile long.
I even took it out wheeling and only got it stuck being stupid.
But with the awd of a rex i can really go out and play.
Rememeber kids... spell check is your friend
De Lara (Cortana) wrote:
this thread needed a SS/TC pic
it's a fun car to drive. i enjoy it when i can and get great mileage.
as Joe said, the seats are GREAT. im confirmation that they are fat kid friendly. lol
once the money is there for exhaust, intake and tune then i'll be more happy with it
go test drive one. i let all my friends handle Cortana and they love her.
it just sounds like a car you will be happy with too.
something you sound like your looking for
lemme take her for a rip?????
I will start taking test drives tho when i have the funds..
Rememeber kids... spell check is your friend
Mr.Goodwrench-G.T. wrote:[quote=97cavie24ls(™)]Mr.Goodwrench-G.T. wrote:Bill Hahn Jr. wrote:Here...let's be fair. Let ME try this approach.
When a WRX is capable of remotely doing and sounding anything like this, then I would sway Subie. But hands down, SS/TC any day.
Schaffer, good luck on what you decide... and don't forget to take pics.
gotta side with bill on this 1 , you opened the can of spam first , lol
Naaa, I beg to differ on that.
I still stand, a street Cobalt's 4cyl will never sound as ferocious as the WRX. Best of all, you need less than $1K to open up the exhaust to listen to that boxer rumble. Last but not least, when you want to have fun, it is nice that you have the ability to power oversteer at will, instead being plagued with FWD understeer.
Let him show all the tube chassis drag racing Cobalts he wants, after he is changing engines after 20 miles of use, I will be at the gas station refilling up the WRX.
but that 1000 to make it sound better isnt gonna match the mileage of the ss/tc , lol
which is more of what he wants
though i know of a few ways to alter the sound of the eco
Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Tuesday, November 10, 2009 10:18 PM
Mr.Goodwrench-G.T. wrote:[quote=97cavie24ls(™)]Mr.Goodwrench-G.T. wrote:Bill Hahn Jr. wrote:Here...let's be fair. Let ME try this approach.
When a WRX is capable of remotely doing and sounding anything like this, then I would sway Subie. But hands down, SS/TC any day.
Schaffer, good luck on what you decide... and don't forget to take pics.
gotta side with bill on this 1 , you opened the can of spam first , lol
Naaa, I beg to differ on that.
I still stand, a street Cobalt's 4cyl will never sound as ferocious as the WRX. Best of all, you need less than $1K to open up the exhaust to listen to that boxer rumble. Last but not least, when you want to have fun, it is nice that you have the ability to power oversteer at will, instead being plagued with FWD understeer.
Let him show all the tube chassis drag racing Cobalts he wants, after he is changing engines after 20 miles of use, I will be at the gas station refilling up the WRX.
Let Goodwrench orgasm about all the highly-edited vids of highly-modded WRXs with 90 PSI in the tires he wants. After he is changing his shorts once realizing such a car costs $250,000 and may actually require more than one take during exten$ive filming to make him jizz in his pants, I will be on the road enjoying an actual street-legal SS/TC.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edited Wednesday, November 11, 2009 12:59 AM
Bill Hahn Jr.
Hahn RaceCraft
World's Quickest and Fastest Street J-Bodies
Turbocharging GM FWD's since 1988
www.turbosystem.com
Schaffer wrote:
lemme take her for a rip?????
I will start taking test drives tho when i have the funds..
come down to florida and you can take her down the road lol
test drives are good
14.4 @ 101 Bradenton Motorsports Park 11/22/08
i like both.
but chevy has hit a homerun with the t/c cobaltss for sure.
i've been thinking a wrx over more and more...i'd still get 25 mpg highway,which isn't terrible,have AWD and the boxer rumble i love..
Plus i can get a rather decent one for under 12k....a decent sstc is 18 at least.
Rememeber kids... spell check is your friend
it's all up to you man. seriously just go with your gut on this one. If the little gas mileage difference doesn't kill your wallet too bad, get the car you REALLY want out of the 2.
On the other hand....you have other fingers.
In my family we teach that boys have a God-stick and girls have a Shame Cave. -John Stewart
25mpg Highway is terrible, I get that from a 20 year old f-body, the fact a modern 4 cylinder does that is pathetic
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
Rodimus Prime wrote:25mpg Highway is terrible, I get that from a 20 year old f-body, the fact a modern 4 cylinder does that is pathetic
meh...
Rememeber kids... spell check is your friend
