ImportFyghter wrote:

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Wow way to go Mr. Magazine racer. How many LT1's have you seen run?

Magazine racer? I have been drag racing since 1989, how about you? I have literally seen hundreds of LT-1's run, my former club G.M.M.O.C. (GM Muscle of the Carolinas) had plenty of members go to the track with me, and I lived 3 miles from an 1/8th mile track when I owned my house in North Carolina. How long have you been racing son? Know some facts before opening your mouth and attacking me.

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My AUTO 96' ran 14.0 BONE STOCK with tractions issues.

Good for you. It is still much slower than an '01 Cobra. Let me inform you since you don't have a damn clue as to what a Cobra is capable of in the right hands, or maybe your reading skills are just not up to par with the average 8th grader. 1996 and 1997 Cobras average in the 255 rwhp range and were mostly in the high 13 second range. 1998's got a more aggressive tune and 265 rwhp and were capable of running mid 13's (Bob Cosby ran 13.4 at 104 in his 1996 bone dead stock on street tires). The '99 and '01 had a lot of revisions and were low 13 second capable at 105.5 to 106. I was there when PHP ran a 12.96 with just DR's in a then new '01 Cobra with no mods. I have also driven my friends 96 Cobra many times down the track back home and his friends WS-6 Ram air 96 T/A auto as well. Those 2 were fairly close in ET's but the Cobra trapped consistently 2 mph higher (82 versus 80 in the 1/8th) at an 800 foot altitude 1/8th mile track, DA in the 1500 foot range.

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With just an exhaust i was in the 13's. My last 96' i had with a stick ran 13.7 also stone stock. It doesnt take much to make an LT-1 crank. A decent LT1 will get and LS1 out of the hole, but lack on top end compared to the LS1.

Has anyone disputed this? Why are you arguing it then? And thank you for showing that they are both still slower than an '01 Cobra, especially with mods.

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an 01' Cobra will NOT run deep in the 12's with gears exhaust and intake.

And how many '01 Cobras have you seen run with gears and exaust? I have seen at least a half dozen of them. 4.10's will take a half second of ET of the undergeared Cobra. The exaust gets rwhp up into the 290 range (they were 275-280 from the factory) and are easily capable of runing deep in the 12's. If you doubt it, we can go to the Corral and see what the results to the question will be. The car has been tested by many sources to 13.3 bone dead stock with autoweek getting a 106 mph trap speed out of it. Of the 2 that ran at Martin this past summer consistently with these exact mods, one was running 12.7X at 108 with street tires, the other turned in the 12.5 range with DR's, can't remember the trap. While these times are not exactly blazing they are consistent to what a 6spd '01-02 LS-1 will do with sticky tires and a lid.

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Ive seen alot of newer mustangs run like @!#$.

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Drivers are everything. The kid I ran in his stock '00 at Stanton was running consistent 13.9's at 100 last May when the track opened. Same day another guy in his Bullit couldn't break mid 14's at 95-96 to save his life and lost to the same kid I had smoked badly.

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Dont get my wrong i like the new stangs but they dont respond to mods like they used to.

Is this why the 4.6 SOHC has been built to run 340 rwhp naturally aspirated? Is this why Bob Cosby in his 99 held the NMRA Stock eliminator record with an et in the 11.40's (which has since been broken)? I talked to Bob last year at Martin about his car, it was just lots of good hard work and blueprinting that got him those times along with good driving. Stock eliminator is a very restrictive class.

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Give me an old fox body 5.0 anyday. Go to any camaro forum..or hell even a mustang forum and ask these same questions. Mustang owners know who in charge here. Im just glad i down own either. 430HP LT4 all the way.

It's sure as hell not the LT-1 or an auto LS-1 against the '01 Cobra with mods, and this was the point I was making and somehow escaped you. I will be happy to take you up on either of these offers, I have been on CamaroZ28.com for over 6 years and am in the top 5 posting wise, or I can take you up on that offer on the Corral or Stangnet where I have been a member just as long. ANd if you are ever in West Michigan be sure to tell me, I would love to show that 430 hp LT-4 some tail lights

sappyL61 wrote:

ImportFyghter wrote:

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Wow way to go Mr. Magazine racer. How many LT1's have you seen run? My AUTO 96' ran 14.0 BONE STOCK with tractions issues. With just an exhaust i was in the 13's. My last 96' i had with a stick ran 13.7 also stone stock. It doesnt take much to make an LT-1 crank. A decent LT1 will get and LS1 out of the hole, but lack on top end compared to the LS1. an 01' Cobra will NOT run deep in the 12's with gears exhaust and intake. Ive seen alot of newer mustangs run like @!#$. Dont get my wrong i like the new stangs but they dont respond to mods like they used to. Give me an old fox body 5.0 anyday. Go to any camaro forum..or hell even a mustang forum and ask these same questions. Mustang owners know who in charge here. Im just glad i down own either. 430HP LT4 all the way.

swap the rearend in the cobra and itll be in 12's
of course do it to a camaro and it should be 11's

Add sticky tires to 4.10's in a LS-1 and watch the rear end go boom. The 10 bolt in most cases can not handle the power. One of our club members grenaded his 10 bolt last summer for this exact reason, and no, it didn't run 11's

I will also add that I hate this boards lack of an edit feature.

ok but the 01 cobra still got pulled on in the top end, 3rd and up by a stock auto ls1

FOURTWENTY240sx wrote:ok but the 01 cobra still got pulled on in the top end, 3rd and up by a stock auto ls1

With 4.10 gears it shouldn't as the top end is equal to the LS-1 (over 160 mph) because of the more effective use of 5th gear. Most of the auto LS-1's I have raced against have ranged anywhere from 100 mph traps to 103-104. A female in my club has mods on her '02 SS and has only run 102.XX. The density altitude always sucks here (I have not raced at under 2300 ft. density altitude), but the Cobras were running at the same time. The lightly modded 6spds were running right there with the Cobras in the 12's, but the auto's for some reason tend to be quite a bit slower here, for what reason I don't know.

i hate to tell you, but with the exception of the ford 9 inch, ford's rear end's are garbage too...

EastCoastBeast II wrote:i hate to tell you, but with the exception of the ford 9 inch, ford's rear end's are garbage too...

A Ford 8.8 is almost identical in design to the G.M. 12 bolt. The 8.8 is a damn good rear and can hold much more hp than a G.M. 10 bolt stock, and with 31 spline axles and even a stock 31 spline T-Lok can handle quite a lot of power. The 10 bolt and Australian 9 bolt on the 3rd gens are crap and should have never been put behind such a potent powertrain combo.

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Add sticky tires to 4.10's in a LS-1 and watch the rear end go boom. The 10 bolt in most cases can not handle the power. One of our club members grenaded his 10 bolt last summer for this exact reason, and no, it didn't run 11's

Might wanna take a look at my post before last. I agree 100% that the F-Body rearends are complete GARBAGE.

I dunno where the hell you live but im a regular at the races on weekend and i talk to pretty much everyone there and i have a few buddies with both stangs and camaro's. I can honestly say ive NEVER seen a cobra run into the 12's with gears intake and exhaust. To be totally honest, ive never seen any newer stangs run sub 12 second pas without a power adder. I dunno im not being biased or anything cuz ive owned both. Oh and im also a member over at CamaroZ28.com. Im not being a dick just sharing some info on what ive seen here locally. Maybe you'd like to take a trip down to Ohio and match up against my 97' Big Block Stang? check out my auction for my ol' 308. Maybe you'd know someone interested.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7958258237


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A Ford 8.8 is almost identical in design to the G.M. 12 bolt. The 8.8 is a damn good rear and can hold much more hp than a G.M. 10 bolt stock, and with 31 spline axles and even a stock 31 spline T-Lok can handle quite a lot of power. The 10 bolt and Australian 9 bolt on the 3rd gens are crap and should have never been put behind such a potent powertrain combo.

Agreed. Our last 86' mustang GT ran 10.60 with the stock 8.8 rear. I wanna run DR's in my camaro but im afraid to break something. Damn you GM.


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ImportFyghter wrote:

I dunno where the hell you live but im a regular at the races on weekend and i talk to pretty much everyone there and i have a few buddies with both stangs and camaro's.

I live a few miles from Martin Michigan where 131 motorsports is, I lived in North Carolina a few miles from a small strip called Roxboro Motorsports and I have run at Rockingham Dragway, Fayetteville, Martin, and Stanton. When test and tune is going on I am usually there and I have run in several events in the true street classes, not being very successful as you have to have a 9 second car these days to win these type of events.

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I can honestly say ive NEVER seen a cobra run into the 12's with gears intake and exhaust.

Just because you have not seen it does not mean it does not happen. I suggest you go to a Fun Ford weekend race, an NMRA race or to the spring or fall 5.0 civil wars. You might be surprised.

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To be totally honest, ive never seen any newer stangs run sub 12 second pas without a power adder. I dunno im not being biased or anything cuz ive owned both. Oh and im also a member over at CamaroZ28.com. Im not being a dick just sharing some info on what ive seen here locally. Maybe you'd like to take a trip down to Ohio and match up against my 97' Big Block Stang? check out my auction for my ol' 308. Maybe you'd know someone interested.

Try the Great Lakes section of CamaroZ28.com. I will run anything win or lose, I have lost my fair share of races at the track over the years. Since you are in Ohio go to the Fun Ford weekend race at Norwalk this year, it's a large event with a lot of different classes and you will get to see some of the Mustang setups that are out there right now. Again the point to this is driver is everything. Case in point: When I was running at Roxboro one Wednesday night back in 1999 a guy in his brand new LS-1 tried to go down the track for the first time. He ran back to back to back mid 12 second times in the 1/8th mile and only trapped in the low 70's. Needless to say he lost to a 3.4 Camaro, a 3.8 Camaro and a 3.8 Mustang. That track never had VHT sprayed and was slick as glass. I hated the place, but it was only 3 miles from my house. I learned a good bit of self determined traction control at that place.

ImportFyghter wrote:

Agreed. Our last 86' mustang GT ran 10.60 with the stock 8.8 rear. I wanna run DR's in my camaro but im afraid to break something. Damn you GM.

I saw a place, I can't remember where, advertised that they would do an 8.8 Ford swap on an F-body complete with 31 spline axles and 9 inch Ford axle ends to get rid of the c-clip retaining system for less than the cost of a 12 bolt swap. You might want to do a search for it. I have been running a worn out t-lok for a while, the locker I have and the 31 spline mosers are a welcome change.

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Just because you have not seen it does not mean it does not happen. I suggest you go to a Fun Ford weekend race, an NMRA race or to the spring or fall 5.0 civil wars. You might be surprised.

Been to a few..they are huge so half the time i dont talk to all drivers to know there combo's. Hopefully the car will be done for it this year as i plan to run in the true street class. Your right about the competition, there all fast. Last year the fastest car ran a 9.10 i believe? The year before Lee Howie came out up top with an 8.60's avg. Im planning on running mid 10's on motor. i have a 100 shot i may run for the event but im unsure yet. Also, i never thought but the track i run at on weekends is a little hick like track and traction is horrible. Ive only run norwalk a few times last year and i remember it being sticky as hell. Ive even see some guys lose there shoe on that track.

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I saw a place, I can't remember where, advertised that they would do an 8.8 Ford swap on an F-body complete with 31 spline axles and 9 inch Ford axle ends to get rid of the c-clip retaining system for less than the cost of a 12 bolt swap. You might want to do a search for it. I have been running a worn out t-lok for a while, the locker I have and the 31 spline mosers are a welcome change.

Sounds good but funds suck at this point in time. Being 20 and owning 2 sports car sucks (can you believe the classify my 93' Z24 a sports car?). The stang is a father-son project which he sheds out the bucks for (which i dont mind) and im driver. my plans for the summer is to get my LT4 kit on, SS hood, and find a decent priced CM exhaust. Nice thing about owning a ford and a chevy is i can attend both Super Chave and Fun ford


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Chave? ha...meant Chevy..


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A Ford 8.8 is almost identical in design to the G.M. 12 bolt. The 8.8 is a damn good rear and can hold much more hp than a G.M. 10 bolt stock



so you're comparing a 8.8 to a 12 bolt, or a 10 bolt?

EastCoastBeast II wrote:



so you're comparing a 8.8 to a 12 bolt, or a 10 bolt?

Comparing it to the 12 bolt and the 10 bolt. The 12 bolt is usually the rear end of choice for the F-body people as it is much better than the 10 bolt and should have been standard on the LS-1 F-body, and the 8.8 is almost identical. The 8.8's weakest links are the stock 28 spline axles and C-clip retention, but it weighs less than a 9 inch and comsumes less horsepower. It's a good rearend overall and can handle lots of punishment if prepped right.