TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI) - Tuning Forum

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TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI)
Friday, July 15, 2005 4:42 PM
http://www.sdsefi.com

This seems like a moderately decent tuning platform for those wanting to go cheaper than an AEM EMS / Greddy E-manage / Haltech route and at the same time, you don't have to put it together like a Megasquirt system. Their EM-4 D seems pretty basic, whie the EM-4 also has support for aftermarket MSD boxes as well as the EM-4 F kit, which looks like the best option for J bodies with coil packs. And check it out... 3 bar MAP sensors for you heavy boost guys.

What do you guys think? Sound like a decent option?





I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.

Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI)
Friday, July 15, 2005 5:17 PM
Spotabee - Just last night I had a long conversation with an extremely knowledgeable J-body boost tuning guy in Canada we work with some and he mentioned this in the same context you did: Effective; Cheaper than Greddy; Simpler than Megasquirt. Since we're in the process of working on tuning solutions, we're going to look into this very hard. But he knew of some folks in Canada that have used the system and were happy with it. We'll be getting one soon to start testing so we should have some first-hand intel on it before too long.

Leo
Cavalier Connection
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Friday, July 15, 2005 5:23 PM
Leo Cadorette wrote:

Spotabee - Just last night I had a long conversation with an extremely knowledgeable J-body boost tuning guy in Canada we work with some and he mentioned this in the same context you did: Effective; Cheaper than Greddy; Simpler than Megasquirt. Since we're in the process of working on tuning solutions, we're going to look into this very hard. But he knew of some folks in Canada that have used the system and were happy with it. We'll be getting one soon to start testing so we should have some first-hand intel on it before too long.

Leo
Cavalier Connection


I just remembered reading about this system this afternoon. I know a guy here in Kansas City who is running this system on his supercharged VW Scirocco.
http://www.houseofboost.com/members.dorianc.html
From what I understand, the system seems to work real well. And with what I am reading, this would be a good way to tune for boost with our cars, considering our ECU's cannot read boost and these obviously can. The one problem I'd love to solve is the 95-97 2.2 OHV injector issue. It looks like this kit would work great if you converted the fuel rail for topfeeds, used their injector harness, and did tuning... imagine the results...





I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Friday, July 15, 2005 5:28 PM
Ummm . . . too early to get excited, but we also discussed the 95-97 2.2 OHV injector challenge last night and he put us on to something that may be the answer . . . we're on that one too! - Leo
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Friday, July 15, 2005 6:01 PM
Leo Cadorette wrote:

Ummm . . . too early to get excited, but we also discussed the 95-97 2.2 OHV injector challenge last night and he put us on to something that may be the answer . . . we're on that one too! - Leo


Awesome. Keep me posted. I'm searching for the answer to this problem just like every other OHV owner in need of more fuel




I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Friday, July 15, 2005 6:25 PM
Leo-

This works great for the 2.2L, 2200, and 2.4L, but the Eco's have a bit of a hard time with the SDS. HAAS was using the SDS as the fuel upgrade sold with thier kits, and those who got it to work were very happy with it, however those who didn't (Eco people) were rather ticked. I'd do extensive testing on the Eco with the SDS, and make sure to get a fool proof instruction manual, before offering it to that crowd.

Good luck.





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Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Friday, July 15, 2005 6:26 PM
3 bar. hmmm... no one on this site is boosting over 28 lbs, but its good to know it's available.


My Car
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Friday, July 15, 2005 6:34 PM
Sunfires rule! (Tom) wrote:

3 bar. hmmm... no one on this site is boosting over 28 lbs, but its good to know it's available.


it just gives more motivation knowing that there is support for that if we should decide to take that step. 30 psi sounds really really fun for a j body.




I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Friday, July 15, 2005 7:55 PM
I personally have the 034efi unit. From what I've seen around I'm extremly confident I can run atleast 10lbs on my 2200. Keep in mind I'm using 2 forty lb injectors AND the msd w/ boost retard.

I haven't received my turbo yet so I don't know exactly how things will work out. But this system and those like it seem to be a good idea.




<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/purplhaze">My registry</a>
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Friday, July 15, 2005 9:11 PM
shifted, your misundering what Spotabee is talking about. he is talking about SDS's Standalone Engine Management System, not their AIC unit. Two TOTALLY different things. but, spotabee and Leo, ive looked into their Standalone EMS before. it looks quite promising. but, alas i dont have that kind of money right now. nor the patience to do the tuning. good luck with all your projects tho Leo, def keep JBO updated if you dont mind. later all.


"God invented turbo lag to give V8's a chance"
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Friday, July 15, 2005 9:31 PM
The only thing people might find daunting about the SDS system, you have to flush mount 2 magnets to your crank pulley along w/ a hall sensor to read them...

Not a big deal, but on the 2.4, the pulley has only 3 spokes, and they are kind of indented... You'll see what I mean...I was originally going to use this system- I had some guys @ my fathers work make a round 1/4" thick steel plate that fits snug inside the crank pulley, and attaches with flush mounted machine screws- You can't weld to the pulley because of some rubber balancer ring inside it.

Also, you will need some way to control your idle- find some kind of TB w/ an idle adjustment screw- or possibly just glue the IAC in place.???

I wouldnt call it cheaper than greddy though, runs around 1200 bucks for the standalone.. Maybe you were referring to the EIC? But my friend uses the standalone on his jetta, and it really does work well..

BTW- if anyone is going to use this system, I have that steel plate for the crank pulley...



<img src=http://registry.gmenthusiast.com/images/reddevil/Devil.jpg>

Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Friday, July 15, 2005 9:40 PM
one thing with said above mentioned stand alones

does that mean your factory gauges are of no use anymore?

are you forced to resort to aftermarket gauge company's for speedo/tach?

maybe its a bit off topic, but I've yet to find a simpler solution to this problem.

Steve


<a href="http://www.cardomain.com/id/fireside"><img src="http://www.influx.ca/avatars/stevefiresig.jpg"></a>
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Saturday, July 16, 2005 2:57 AM
RedDevil wrote:

The only thing people might find daunting about the SDS system, you have to flush mount 2 magnets to your crank pulley along w/ a hall sensor to read them...

Not a big deal, but on the 2.4, the pulley has only 3 spokes, and they are kind of indented... You'll see what I mean...I was originally going to use this system- I had some guys @ my fathers work make a round 1/4" thick steel plate that fits snug inside the crank pulley, and attaches with flush mounted machine screws- You can't weld to the pulley because of some rubber balancer ring inside it.

Also, you will need some way to control your idle- find some kind of TB w/ an idle adjustment screw- or possibly just glue the IAC in place.???

I wouldnt call it cheaper than greddy though, runs around 1200 bucks for the standalone.. Maybe you were referring to the EIC? But my friend uses the standalone on his jetta, and it really does work well..

BTW- if anyone is going to use this system, I have that steel plate for the crank pulley...


I want my car to idle liked a cammed big block... like @!#$ basically. Intimidation rules. lol

I have next to no money right now, simply because I'm still very busy with school. But I love learning. If someone or another company said they wanted to team up with Spotabee Racing (my tech site / shop one day) and put together a project J body to be boosted and tuned on SDS, I'd be all over it. But I just don't have the kind of cash to support this kind of project right now. We're already almost done with our 4sd 4dr Honda Civic... estimated low 13s and under $1500 spent.





I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Saturday, July 16, 2005 2:59 AM
purplhaze wrote:

I personally have the 034efi unit. From what I've seen around I'm extremly confident I can run atleast 10lbs on my 2200. Keep in mind I'm using 2 forty lb injectors AND the msd w/ boost retard.

I haven't received my turbo yet so I don't know exactly how things will work out. But this system and those like it seem to be a good idea.


You said you are using 2 as in TWO 40# injectors and the MSD Boost Timing Master... is that a mistype or are you really only running 2 injectors. If this is correct, please fill me in if I am missing something.




I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Saturday, July 16, 2005 9:28 AM
Spotabee Racing wrote:

purplhaze wrote:

I personally have the 034efi unit. From what I've seen around I'm extremly confident I can run atleast 10lbs on my 2200. Keep in mind I'm using 2 forty lb injectors AND the msd w/ boost retard.

I haven't received my turbo yet so I don't know exactly how things will work out. But this system and those like it seem to be a good idea.


You said you are using 2 as in TWO 40# injectors and the MSD Boost Timing Master... is that a mistype or are you really only running 2 injectors. If this is correct, please fill me in if I am missing something.


He is probably running two extra injectors controlled by the 034efi

so six total but two are only used under boost





Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Saturday, July 16, 2005 9:41 AM
I am kind of confused, so the basic unit is less then an emanage so less then 400$ or so. And how exactly does it work?



LE61T PTE6262 Powered

Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Saturday, July 16, 2005 10:03 AM
all it does is incorperates another computer to controll 2 injectors (depending on your need which size..) that are mounted into 2 injector bosses and are welded into your charged pipe near the TB and controls those two injectors via the computer they send you only under boost. Your car will run normal as if nuthing was different on your stock injectors untill you reach positive pressure thats when the other computer and injectors assist for more fue per boost. I was gonna go this route becuase i couldnt stay from running lean ( befor i got the for red tops instead of my gmsc inj.) on my eco, it would have cost around 400-500 bucks for all the stuff, but alot of people say its more ghetto then running bigger injectors with a FMU ...i kinda like the idea behind it. Alot of people who do use this with there Haas kits and their Ecos said that it was running REALLY rich under boost and couldnt controll it.
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Saturday, July 16, 2005 10:58 AM
thats the sds eic... this is different I believe



LE61T PTE6262 Powered

Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Saturday, July 16, 2005 1:55 PM
yah the SDS EIC is what the HAAS ppl were having fuel issues with. SDS's standalone system is different. not only is it a standalone, but it can also control 2 to 4 extra injectors, i forget exactly. and you can tune it with the standalones control system thingy. def different than their EIC system.


"God invented turbo lag to give V8's a chance"
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Sunday, July 17, 2005 2:14 AM
YlwLsSprt (The Original) wrote:

yah the SDS EIC is what the HAAS ppl were having fuel issues with. SDS's standalone system is different. not only is it a standalone, but it can also control 2 to 4 extra injectors, i forget exactly. and you can tune it with the standalones control system thingy. def different than their EIC system.


no wonder HAAS went out of business. They were trying to sell a turbo kit using EIC for fuel support / management. And most of the kit was copied and cheaply fabbed up anyways.




I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Sunday, July 17, 2005 8:32 AM
04 ecotec LS Sport wrote:

Spotabee Racing wrote:

purplhaze wrote:

I personally have the 034efi unit. From what I've seen around I'm extremly confident I can run atleast 10lbs on my 2200. Keep in mind I'm using 2 forty lb injectors AND the msd w/ boost retard.

I haven't received my turbo yet so I don't know exactly how things will work out. But this system and those like it seem to be a good idea.


You said you are using 2 as in TWO 40# injectors and the MSD Boost Timing Master... is that a mistype or are you really only running 2 injectors. If this is correct, please fill me in if I am missing something.


He is probably running two extra injectors controlled by the 034efi

so six total but two are only used under boost


^^ thats what I'm doing. The regular stock fuel system will run by itself under vacuum. When I hit hit boost the two extra injectors will start working. So in total I will be using 6 injectors.




<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/purplhaze">My registry</a>

Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Sunday, July 17, 2005 4:18 PM
I truly think Megasquirt is one of the best options right now. It has proven it's self on Dj's car. From what I have been told putting it together is not bad at all. If you do not want to put it together then why are you modding a J anyways.

Another comment made by someone that state they did not want to take the time to deal with tuning. Well you better not go boost, you have to tune regardless of what set up you run.



FU Tuning



Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Monday, July 18, 2005 10:14 AM
I am one of the victims of HAAS. I had the SDS-EIC. As mentioned, it did run very rich. Basically there is a threshhold and a gain knob. One tells it when to supply additional fuel and one controls how much fuel. It cycles through in 25% cycles. Some people have had great success and others haven't. It connects straight to the schrader valve for the fuel source, For the added fuel I added the Walbro 255lph pump. I also kept having serious fuel leak issues. Too many connections = too many potential leaks. Anyhow don't let me discourage people from going this route. I just got rid of the stock injectors and the SDS-EIC and went with 370cc injectors. Anyone interested in an sds-eic? email me.
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Monday, July 18, 2005 1:17 PM
Well I'm beyond SDS EIC right now. I would really like to stay away from EIC for as long as I can. My question was more about the EM-4 F system and what everyone thought of it.




I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.
Re: TUNING: Simple Digital Systems (a.k.a. SDS EFI
Monday, July 18, 2005 1:43 PM
Hey spotabee, sorry not to familiar with the EM-4 F system. Just thought I would drop my 2 cents worth of experience with the SDS-EIC. Sorry if I jacked your thread.
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