Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing? - Tuning Forum

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Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 10:35 AM
Hey guys,
I know that the gm s/c reflash retards the timing a lot, and theres lots of heresay that if one where to use HPTuners software to advance it, there would be more power gained. Now has anybody tried this? also, is it retarded as much as it is for safety reasons (to not even come close to the limits of the motor for a durable product straight from dealer). Cause, i have 2 options. Buy another block, and do a slight build, or laptop + software and squeeze more out of my current 01 s/c setup.

Speedracer, Josh..any input.



Evolution of Cavyboy-->C22t--> C24na--->c24s/c
1995 Cavalier W/2k1 Engine
GM S/C 13.940@99.78pmh w/2.068 60ft

Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 10:51 AM
gm has the timing curve set to keep the motor alive for 100,000 miles , and they have it set well into the safe zone


they figure on bad gas , and some one using 87


i will be changing the timing , once i get the hp tuners , ive got alky injection , and 101 pump gas close , but i will have a street program and a track program







Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 10:58 AM
I'm really interested in seeing how that goes. I'll be hoping to stand on the shoulders of those of you who know what you're doing when I finally get the money together for the HPT.

Otherwise, I'd be the guy that blows up his engine because he doesn't know WTF he's doing.





Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 11:04 AM
i say squeeze the most outta the current set up. Hp tuners all the way buddy. keep us updated and good luck.







Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 11:25 AM
yeah let me know how that timing advance goes, im really interested in this


2006 Black Cobalt SS Supercharged G85
13.91@102.77
Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 12:41 PM
97cavie24ls(JDM&00s/c sedans™) wrote:

gm has the timing curve set to keep the motor alive for 100,000 miles , and they have it set well into the safe zone


they figure on bad gas , and some one using 87


i will be changing the timing , once i get the hp tuners , ive got alky injection , and 101 pump gas close , but i will have a street program and a track program


Which version of hp tuners will you be using? Standard or Enhanced?

Nate



Evolution of Cavyboy-->C22t--> C24na--->c24s/c
1995 Cavalier W/2k1 Engine
GM S/C 13.940@99.78pmh w/2.068 60ft
Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 1:02 PM
I would go with the enhanced........Thats the one I'm buyin here very shortly.........I'm very interested to see how much better my car will run and how much it will gain with the hptuners..........seein as how all I have is the fmu......and no reflash because of bein a 99.........

Keep us updated on ur experience with the software!



Car is for Sale!Supercharger kit is for sale!
Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 1:15 PM
Wild Weasel wrote:

I'm really interested in seeing how that goes. I'll be hoping to stand on the shoulders of those of you who know what you're doing when I finally get the money together for the HPT.

Otherwise, I'd be the guy that blows up his engine because he doesn't know WTF he's doing.



i am right there with you on this one


listening......





RIP JESSE GERARD.....Youll always be in my thoughts and prayers...



Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 1:29 PM
First thing Im going to try is swapping the values for the high octane into the low octane table and start running premium. Im not sure if it takes time for it to relearn once this is done, but I will have access to a dyno this weekend hopefully.


___________________________________________________________________

15.149 @ 91.26mph 3-18-2006
Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 1:32 PM
BlackEco wrote:

First thing Im going to try is swapping the values for the high octane into the low octane table and start running premium. Im not sure if it takes time for it to relearn once this is done, but I will have access to a dyno this weekend hopefully.


Make sure you do some data logging for knock first, and get rid of that, then you will want to pull your low octane table back a couple degrees so your motor has some place to go when it senses knock.





4cyltuner.com - Information Source For 4 Cylinder Tuners
Buy stuff from CarCustoms Ebay! Won't be disappointed!

Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 05, 2006 3:35 PM
i will be getting the enhanced version , if im gonna spend the $$$$ im gonna go all out


i just gotta get past a few bills , then get the money together








Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Tuesday, June 06, 2006 10:25 AM
work ends monday for the summer.. mwahahaha! a perk of being a sys admin at a school.

lol i still need another damn cav

anyway asap ill get my ish together and see how i can help out.



Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Tuesday, June 06, 2006 11:07 AM
Shifted wrote:

BlackEco wrote:

First thing Im going to try is swapping the values for the high octane into the low octane table and start running premium. Im not sure if it takes time for it to relearn once this is done, but I will have access to a dyno this weekend hopefully.


Make sure you do some data logging for knock first, and get rid of that, then you will want to pull your low octane table back a couple degrees so your motor has some place to go when it senses knock.


Sweet cause I was doing the same thing!

________

Also, im anxious to see what you s/c guys can get out of his timing adv. I've always thought your track times could be atleast a full second better with some tweaks in the ECU but at the time there wasn't anything besides $1k+ equip to do it with. Good luck!


N2O + Bolt-ons = 220Hp/250Tq

Coming Soon:HpTunersPro, EagleConnectingRods, WiescoPistons, 13sec2200

Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Tuesday, June 06, 2006 1:43 PM
This is how water/alky injection can actually add hp.


- 93 mph in the 1/8 mile
Member of J-Body Of Michigan.

Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Thursday, June 15, 2006 12:41 PM
Skilz10179 wrote:

This is how water/alky injection can actually add hp.


Have engine Runup WI kit.

So not quite sure i understand the low octane vs high octane tables. Why would the pcm have both,when the car was made to run low, and they suppose to use high when reflashe?

THanks
Nate



Evolution of Cavyboy-->C22t--> C24na--->c24s/c
1995 Cavalier W/2k1 Engine
GM S/C 13.940@99.78pmh w/2.068 60ft
Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Thursday, June 15, 2006 11:47 PM
It's cheaper to blow them up then to build them up

O noes!
Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Friday, June 16, 2006 4:16 AM
I wanted to chime in on this one.

Generally GM sets up their engines to run pig rich and retarded timing to extend the life of the engine for the standard driver, even with their supercharged units.

You can safely advance the timing and lean out the fuel curve, but I would suggust that you do so incrementally, and dependent on the amount of boost your running as well.

You dont need to run super rich to get horsepower, as they will tell you at innovative autosports, you can run 12.7 on your acceleration with slightly retarded timing and get more out of your engine than at 11.1 and full advance.

There is a magical number your looking to hit with your setup, and hp tuners can get you there. There are also programs out there that you can get which can calculate these magic numbers fairly accurately, giving you a base tune in which to remove knock from, and tweak for power.

Tuning is not for the weak at heart, as you can actually spin bearing and throw rods if your not careful. Oh and blown pistons is a easy one to do also. By the way, if you have EGR i noticed a power increase when i set the EGR enable to so high it didnt enable, and then retarded the timing to get rid of knock. I hate EGR, i hate emissions controls, you can get a cleaner running engine without them if you tune it right anyway.

As for water/alcohol if your boosting over 6 psi on stock compression its a must, or i think 16psi on lowered compression. I've heard of guys running 15+psi on stock compression with forge pistons and upgraded fuel + alky/water and not getting knock.
Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 19, 2006 5:05 PM
Listening


Friends Don't Let Friends Drive Stock!!!!!
Re: Anybody use HPT w/GM s/c to advance timing?
Monday, June 19, 2006 5:08 PM
Ive noticed on my eco that i need to stay below 12.2 afr to avoid knock , ive also witnessed this on one other ecotec as well, pretty sure that if it holds true for 2 of them it holds true for alot, so tuning AFR to get mid 12s isnt the best to avoid knock



1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85





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