Why not help her to the point that she can make the decision for herself?




Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.

Oh but why can't we just help her a little?



Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.

see this is the problem as i see it, she commited murder and won't be punished for it, in fact, just the opposite will occur, we are supposed to fell sorry for her. i dunno, it just doesn't seem right


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

GAM (The Kilted One) wrote:Why not help her to the point that she can make the decision for herself?

Give it up GAM, there's no point arguing. I don't want to be mean, but jackalope and mikec2003 are little immature in their thinking.


______________________________________________________________

ToBoGgAn wrote:we are gonna take it in the ass and like it, cause thats what america does.

Slo2pt2 (Projekt Unknown?) wrote:One my SON is ADHD N.O.S and Autistic Spectrum Disorder. I will nto medicate him he will battle throught this himself and learn to control it.

what the hell is that supposed to mean. she did a crime and wont be punished for it. is that right, hell no

like i said, she willfully took herself off medication, she basically said "im healed, i don't need these meds anymore, i am a competent and responsible adult without them" and as such, she should be punished as a competent and responsible adult.


being insane is no excuse if you took yourself off the meds that were perscribed.

I just won't feel sorry for this person, and if she doesn't go to jail i will lose all faith in the department of justice, how is it jusice to let a murderer go free?


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

So tell you what Glace why don't you in your wisdom take care of her that way you can feel good for takeing care of your very own murderer. But why should I have to pay my tax money to keep her alive? You want her alive so bad PAY THE BILL !




Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.

SunfireN2o wrote:But she quit taking her medicine at the time because she said the effects of her illness were gone. If she can decide to get off of the pills, she should be responsible for getting back on. IMO

That's the key here. She had serious problems and in a competant state, decided to roll the dice with her meds. So she should be held accountable.

If it had been someone who was mentally damaged beyond hope, it was a failure of the government to take her kids and put her in an institution. But that's not the case, here.


---

exactly the point i was trying to make agustin


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

Agustin, Mike, Jack: take a 6 month course of Haldol, and tell me how fast you'd want to be off it. We don't know (can't tell from the story) if she went off the medication AMA (against medical advice), or another course of treatment was tried, or if she just didn't have the money to continue with it. Also, Haldol is administered by (intramuscular? hypodermic?) injections, unless you know how to rig up yourself, you could do a fair bit of harm.

http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic/haloper_ad.htm
^^ Fun stuff.




Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.

well ok, if she went off of the drug AMA, then she should be punished to the full extent of the law i think, and if it was with medical advice to quit using it, then she should have lost custody of the kids if she is that nuts


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

either way, dont you agree GAM that someone has to be punished for these crimes, i mean a triple homicide cant go unpunished


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

The first version of the story I read was that she willingly went off of it during the summer when she felt better. I'll try to find it.


---

Yes, she should be struck down from where she stands, just like in the Samurai days. She should be killed in a bloody sword fight as an act of revenge to honor her dead children. Clearly she has no respect for children and should be taught a lesson.

After that, the story should be hidden from the public and no one should know about it. The people don't need to know all the little details and the government should regulate what the public should and shouldn't know. It will be an embarassment to America and to the women involved.


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ToBoGgAn wrote:we are gonna take it in the ass and like it, cause thats what america does.

Slo2pt2 (Projekt Unknown?) wrote:One my SON is ADHD N.O.S and Autistic Spectrum Disorder. I will nto medicate him he will battle throught this himself and learn to control it.

^^ I dunno, after reading a few of the newer articles, seems like it's our "system" that is at LEAST partly to blame, and another part falls on her family, even if it seems they did try.

According to this article...

http://insidebayarea.com/sanmateocountytimes/localnews/ci_3138298

...she had checked herself into a hospital a few times, and even called the police on herself. Her mental problems only go back a few years, so are relatively new.


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Glace wrote:Yes, she should be struck down from where she stands, just like in the Samurai days. She should be killed in a bloody sword fight as an act of revenge to honor her dead children. Clearly she has no respect for children and should be taught a lesson.

After that, the story should be hidden from the public and no one should know about it. The people don't need to know all the little details and the government should regulate what the public should and shouldn't know. It will be an embarassment to America and to the women involved.

dude, what is your problem with me......seriously, it seems as if you are trying to make a mockery of me because of what i said in other posts, its really pathetic, get a life


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)

Relax Mike people just don't like being shown that they're wrong. Some more so then others. AGuSTiN I can't believe it your actualy in agreement with myself and Mike. Wow. I agree that she should be held responcible 100% for there deaths. If she had wanted help she should have sought it out before killing her kids. And the family members that knew she went off her meds should be on trial right along with her. ther are just as guiltiy for letting those kids die they basicly helped her throw those poor kids in the drink themselves.

So just to ask you Glace what should be done with her? Nothing? A slap on the hands and a serious scolding and a time out? You liberals are a trip! I got a great idea Glace
how about we put her in a halfway house right next door to you. How does that sound?
Would you like liveing next door to a murderer? What would you suggest we do with her? So far all you've done is mock others and say we're childish. Whats your bright idea for her?




Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.

Quote:

she just didn't have the money to continue with it.

Well........would welfare pay for her medication? Cause I know she was on it.


1997 Sunfire
WAI
pacesetter header
Underdrive pulley = STILL SLOW.
50 shot of NX

Jackalope wrote:So just to ask you Glace what should be done with her? Nothing? A slap on the hands and a serious scolding and a time out? You liberals are a trip! I got a great idea Glace how about we put her in a halfway house right next door to you. How does that sound? Would you like liveing next door to a murderer? What would you suggest we do with her? So far all you've done is mock others and say we're childish. Whats your bright idea for her?

How can I have a discussion with you two? I have the same stance as GAM, but your responses to his thought out, REFERENCED sources include gems like "Ok then give her a rope.", "she should be brutally tortured to within an inch of her life, let to recover for a week, beaten again, recover, beat, rinse and repeat for a year, then kill her", or "Please she should be put down like a common dog at the pound.".

I'm not saying she should be completely released, but killing her just cause? Come on! There are treatments available, there are doctors and clinics that can help. She's a nursing assistant so she's productive to society, she survived an abusive relationship, witnessed by family members that she loved her children immensly, and has voluntarily checked into a psychiatric ward to help her illness.

If she can do all that, you'd think she would kill her children on a whim? Comparing her to a murderer is completely ludicrous. With a murderer, they lack the morals, ethics etc to function, but in this case we have woman who was completely normal only 2 years ago but has now contracted an illness. She should be observed in a psychiatric ward, be giving the proper meds, and treated by qualified doctors.


______________________________________________________________

ToBoGgAn wrote:we are gonna take it in the ass and like it, cause thats what america does.

Slo2pt2 (Projekt Unknown?) wrote:One my SON is ADHD N.O.S and Autistic Spectrum Disorder. I will nto medicate him he will battle throught this himself and learn to control it.

Quote:

She should be observed in a psychiatric ward, be giving the proper meds, and treated by qualified doctors.

How about observed,treated, and be in jail, not a psych ward.


1997 Sunfire
WAI
pacesetter header
Underdrive pulley = STILL SLOW.
50 shot of NX

Ok I'm not sure where to start with that but since you actualy gave a real answer I'll give it a go.

Ok maybe we got a little carried away at first but hey she should expect for people to be pissed at what she did so it suouldn't come as a suprise.

YES and those treatments did her kids a world of good didn't they? Look she needs to be at the very least locked away for the rest of her life. At best she should be exicuted.
So you'd be ok with her being a nurseing assistant for ..... oh lets say your mom or dad.
Would you be cool with that? She'd be doing a valuable job in takeing care of your parents right? You way not want to let her take them to the beach tho. I wouldn't want anything to maybe make her remember and maybe re-inact her little episode.

Dude she killed three people in cold blood. She drove them down to the ocean and threw them in. Shes a murderer no ifs, ands, buts, or whats.

Look its great to have high morals but some people do not need to be allowed in socioty and why should we be forced to keep thse people alive milking our tax dollers to keep them alive? If it offends some people to think that we are going to exicute these people then I have a great idea. For all that are so opposed to these people being exicuted due to there high moral values then those who oppose there death should be billed for there houseing and up keep. You guys want to save there lives? Ok no problem I'm cool with that I can understand your values and morals and you should be the ones who are paying to keep them around. That way your personaly saveing her life. Hey you may even get on T.V. as being a hero. Congrats now you have your own personal murderer that your responcible for.

So what do you think? Good idea? I think so. Hey I tell you what If you say thats not fair or is BS no problem I'll personaly pay the .25 for the bullet to end there life. DEAL?




Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.

Uggghh....fine, you win by default. Let's slash her throat, drink her blood and party till the skies turn crimson.


______________________________________________________________

ToBoGgAn wrote:we are gonna take it in the ass and like it, cause thats what america does.

Slo2pt2 (Projekt Unknown?) wrote:One my SON is ADHD N.O.S and Autistic Spectrum Disorder. I will nto medicate him he will battle throught this himself and learn to control it.

Jackalope wrote: AGuSTiN I can't believe it your actualy in agreement with myself and Mike. Wow. I agree that she should be held responcible 100% for there deaths. If she had wanted help she should have sought it out before killing her kids.

I'm not so sure we're in total agreement. She obviously did seek help. She even called the cops on herself. She even told her family what she was planning to do. She sought help.

Again, the only real question here is ... why did she stop taking the medicines? That question isn't answered. You shouldn't hold such a strong opinion about something we don't fully understand.


---

Dude whats your deal? I never said anything that could be taken the wrong way. What the problem is Glace? I said that she should be allowed to live I even agreed with your wanting her to be re-intergrated into socioty so she could be useful. I don't understand whats wrong? OH is it cause you want her to be left alone and not to bother YOU.
Hmm, well thats mighty hipocritical of you wouldn't you agree? You want her to live,
Cool I'm fine with that but you can pay for her I won't. You want her to be allowed back into socioty to be a nurses aid but you have a problem with her taking care of youe parents? Why? shes rehabilited and on her meds and shes all better now so whats
wrong?

I know whats wrong. You talk a good game but when time comes to put up or shut up you cry flowl. Hipocrite thats all you are. And then you come here and say WE'RE childish? Hello pot I'm kettle how are you today. Look Glace I have no problem with her being allowed to live but those who oppose her death should be the ones to carry the burden. Why should the rest of us be responcible for your personal crusade?






Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.

Mike: I think that a crime such as hers when committed in a state that she was in, isn't a crime at all.. she couldn't at the time comprehend what she was doing. That means the requisite Mens Rea was not present.

I made an analogy earlier, about driving a car when a tire blows out and you kill someone. It wasn't your intent to kill, it happened. Basicallly, she was of sound enough mind to form intent.

As I said, she needs help, not jail. She could well live in an assisted living or mental health institute or something like that... and I'd have no problems with that. Given that she'd have to recieve her medications due to court order in order to progress, I don't think I'd have a problem with her living in a group home setting and re-integrating into society, provided she continue an approved drug course, and have a curfew that would have to be observed.

We don't have full possession of the facts, so, Jack, chill out. If she went off the meds with her doctor's blessing (read the Haldol link, you can drop it abruptly with no immediate deterioration, granted that other therapy is used), your tempest oughtta go back into it's teapot. Even if it was AMA, she could have stopped and not been symptomatic for months... My problem in this is that if she out and TOLD someone what she was going to do, what the hell were these other people doing? if they had any inkling that she had mental instabilities, they ought to have phoned the police, or at the very least, her attending psychiatrist.

I'm not a judge or a doctor, but like I said, once she's back on an even keel mentally, I don't think there will be much need for punishment. That's something that she'll take care of on her own.



Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.

but you see how this kinda enters a grey area, i mean if i had a tire blow and i killed someone, its an accident. this lady apparantly told others what she was gonna do, then executed her plan. if it were a normal minded person, that would be first degree murder. but in her case, she's clinically nuts and not fit of mind, so legally she's not guilty, but its a terrible thing, because these 3 kids died, and nobody will be held accountable. that just will never sit right with me.

and yeah i agree with you, if she told people her plan, why didn't they stop her? thats very odd to me.

i dunno, mabey we shouldn't all be getting into huge arguments when none of us know even 25% of the facts


You'll never touch God's hand
You'll never taste God's breath
Because you'll never see the second coming
Life's too short to be focused on insanity
I've seen the ways of God
I'll take the devil any day
Hail Satan

(slayer, skeleton christ, 2006)