^^^
More like a question of: "what didn't he do wrong?"
-There was political cartoon in the local paper that summarizes it best. After Reagan died there was whole media fiasco that showed Reagan as a great leader (as if America forgot how he has brought this country to the ground), well in this political cartoon it showed two homeless people on the street talking among one another and the caption said; "How come the media did not ask us about Reagan?"
-Another one is "Star Wars" price and the amount it left this country in debt.
-Another was the Corporate welfare, by giving U.S. corporations tax breaks to go and build else where and give huge taxing if build in the U.S. Here is when a large amount of jobs started going over seas.
-Taking 100% credit of winning the "Cold War" when the Soviets in it self imploded with Gorbachev.
You know, I'd rather take a guying lying about his affairs with another woman and protect the country from paparazzi-style media, then have a guy sit on the oval office and address/lie to the nation that United States is peachy and is better off since the Cold War ended.
If that is not 1st class
, then I don't know what is.
THE POLITICALLY INCORRECT ONE.
I think what you were trying to say was this:
What's worse?
-Screwing a clerk, or
-Screwing the country?
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
he's only the leader of ppl stupid enough to follow him
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
Well let's see guys whats worse. Trying to put the star wars defence system in orbit
OR selling the Chinese missile guidance systems to be installed in ICBM's pointed at our country? Taking 100% credit for ending the cold war OR granting permanent most favored nation status directly AFTER they contribute several million dollars to your political party for your election? I've said it before I DON'T CARE WHO HE WAS SCREWING!!! So stop thinking that was the only thing Clinton did. He was busted screwing no less then 4 different women while in office. He excepted campaign contributions from China and as thanks he pushed for them to have permanent most favored nation status for trade. He stole thousands of dollars and was dis-barred from practicing law in his home state. Every single person who objected to ANYTHING he said and were in the public eye they were audited by the IRS. He made sure that the Chinese govt. had access to the latest most advanced missile guidance technology to date as a thank you for the donations. Oh this one is great!! After he received millions in donations from the X-wife of a convicted criminal who had fled the country he gave out presidential pardons to all involved with the case. So just to re-cap what your great
Bill Clinton DID do while in office we'll go in no certain order.
1. Cheated no less then 4 times while in office, lied and got busted for it. So not only is ha a lyer but one that KEPT lying after he was busted.
2. Sold out his country to an enemy for campaign donations.
3. Provided that enemy with the means to target the U.S. with ICBM's.
4. Stole millions from people in his state got busted and dis-barred.
5. Accepted millions in payoff money to pardon convicted criminals.
6. Sent more troops into more parts of the world then ANY other president in history.
7. Awarded more no bid contracts to haliburton then Bush and Chaney EVER have.
8. Used the IRS to get even with anyone how disagreed publicly with him.
And this is the guy that you all think so highly of? And then complain about Regan?
Or Bush? Talk about screwing the country ! Damn how much more screwing can you do other then give away the type of stuff Bill did for cash! And you all wonder WHY he was impeached? Good Lord not only was he a lyer and a thief he sold out this country for a buck so he could be elected. And this is the guy you all emulate? Good God you all are absolutely nuts! Clinton was THEE single worst president in history!!
Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.
1: Lying is a given in politics... welcome to the 18th century.
2: No he didn't... he gave the Chinese a bogus title... Canada and the US do over 1.5 billion dollars a DAY in trade. Most favoured nation? Survey says...
3: As I remember, the Chinese stole those secrets (might be thinking of something else).. either way, it was old tech. And, who gives a damn if he sold those... the whole idea of them is that if everyone has them, no one uses them.
4: ...Over a washy land deal that was hardly the worst crime in the world, other presidents have had personal business go askew, and didn't have a petulant house and senate to contend with, remember that.
5: Every president since Johnson has accepted money for sketchy pardons. This is nothing new.
6: ...Under UN and NATO mandates.
7: ...After a bidding process... Bush & Cheney dumped the contracts in their laps with no bidding.
8: That's a little hard to prove.
You keep forgetting these little bits of information that really turn the argument around.
BTW, Clinton was exonerated of all charges Jack, you keep forgetting that.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
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Well let's see guys whats worse. Trying to put the star wars defence system in orbit OR selling the Chinese missile guidance systems to be installed in ICBM's pointed at our country?
Umm so you know during the 90's China did not point weapon at us anymore. Also the stars wars defense system that was a 100% failure at its purpose, which drove our debt in the Trillions ($$) the worst by any president EVER.
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Taking 100% credit for ending the cold war OR granting permanent most favored nation status directly AFTER they contribute several million dollars to your political party for your election?
Read GAM's response.
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I've said it before I DON'T CARE WHO HE WAS SCREWING!!! So stop thinking that was the only thing Clinton did.
Yet you have to comment on this....
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He was busted screwing no less then 4 different women while in office.
Word of advice, when debating do not become a hypocrite and stating your side all in the same sentence.
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He stole thousands of dollars and was dis-barred from practicing law in his home state. Every single person who objected to ANYTHING he said and were in the public eye they were audited by the IRS.
Unheard of to me, so I will need proof to show this is indeed true and to therefore learn more on this. BTW please do pull it from the Rush Limbaugh reports.
I see you like to comment on China and Clinton a lot. You do know that China IS the one of the best customers that buys our goods right? During the Clinton era our great debt (Thank-you Reagan) was being diminished and during that same plan was we was actually having a surplus, a huge part to that success was from China that was buying our agricultural products, cement, wood, things that China does not have. ALL of this to pay large debt that Reagan gave us. If Clinton's economical plan was still under effect (Let's say Gore as president--now) today the fiscal debt would have been paid out by 2012.
But that plan was destroyed by the clown that this thread is about.
Just so you know, by removing that debt and trying to make it to close at zero as possible, the less you have to tax on individuals. A plan that a true-old world Republican would love (Hint: less tax).
Lastly you dare to speak of campaign contributions and who actually put Clinton into power? And yet you defend Bush? Are you F-ing real?
Please don't get me started on this!
Someone needs to readjust and do some research as to who was the worst president in the 20th century if not ever. I guess if the president can make you laugh or can relate to him, he is automatically a good guy? Can you really be that naive?
BTW if you forgot (as many do) how Reagan was in practicing politics, look no further then Shuartzanegger (sp), proof thats actors should not be in office.
THE POLITICALLY INCORRECT ONE.
I was only pointing out who he got caught screwing I could care less who it was or how many it was only to show his charter, not that I care.
How did him being involved with a land scam that cost the tax payers of his state tons of money escape you? Its the reason why he can no longer practice law in his home state. And you need not look on a report from that wacko Rush to find it as it was all over the news.
The main problem with China in case your not up on current affairs is the way they are
now the #1 nuclear threat to the U.S. and they wouldn't be that threat right now if good old Bill hadn't provided them with the weapons guidance technology that only the U.S. and the Soviets had at the time.
And yup I like less taxes too. Does that make me an evil money grubbing miser? No that just makes me someone who sick and tired of the new democratic parties way of trying to suck as much as 50% out of the pockets of hard working people and I'm sorry if thats fine with you but its not with me! Where did I get the 50% number from?
Hilliary Clinton herself said in a speech that the democratic led govt. knows how to spend the peoples money better then they do. Sounds an awful lot like communism to me. I work hard for what I have and I don't see why I should have to pay all these welfare cases to sit around and push out more mouths to feed. They need to get a job and stop depending on the govt to take care of them like they are children. Its not the govts job to provide for these lazy asses its their own. Cut out all these welfare programs and see how much cash starts to pile up.
Lastly I'm not defending Bush, I'm just getting tired of everyone bashing him as if hes the worst president we've ever had. Hes not that distinction belongs to Mr.Clinton.
and go ahead bring up his campaign finances, doesn't bother me but I bet you wont find where he took money from a foreign govt or as payoff money for pardons. Bush may be alot of these but at least he didn't sell out our country to get elected or pardon convicted criminals either.
Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.
GAM, Mr Goodwrench, couldn't agree with you more. I think bill clinton was an excellent president. "i know alot of dudes with them shortcomings, weed smokin fornicators, there's alot of them" He did awesome things for the economy and country, got high and got some ass at the same time. Hats down to bill clinton.
Sort of off topic:
But is there some policy in US politcs that could knock Bush out of power before his term is up? Because here in Canada if the prime minister looses confidence of the house of commons (like congress) then he his forced to call an election.
Jackalope wrote:How did him being involved with a land scam that cost the tax payers of his state tons of money escape you?
Have the facts of what happened escaped you?
Bill and Hillary Clinton's former lawyer skimmed cash off the deal. That's it. They didn't lie in the fact that they didn't know what was going on, but after they were aprised of it, they wanted to keep a lid on it.
Kinda like how George Bush kept his purchasing of stocks of companies that were going to be awarded Kuwait re-build contracts under a tight seal... or how the bush family has been profiting hand over fist from the obscenely increased prices (*and artificially maintained by not using some the Strategic oil reserve).
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The main problem with China in case your not up on current affairs is the way they are
now the #1 nuclear threat to the U.S. and they wouldn't be that threat right now if good old Bill hadn't provided them with the weapons guidance technology that only the U.S. and the Soviets had at the time.
China could have gotten all the technology they needed from Russia. They bought from the USA... what's the difference?
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And yup I like less taxes too. Does that make me an evil money grubbing miser? No that just makes me someone who sick and tired of the new democratic parties way of trying to suck as much as 50% out of the pockets of hard working people and I'm sorry if thats fine with you but its not with me! Where did I get the 50% number from?
Hilliary Clinton herself said in a speech that the democratic led govt. knows how to spend the peoples money better then they do. Sounds an awful lot like communism to me. I work hard for what I have and I don't see why I should have to pay all these welfare cases to sit around and push out more mouths to feed. They need to get a job and stop depending on the govt to take care of them like they are children. Its not the govts job to provide for these lazy asses its their own. Cut out all these welfare programs and see how much cash starts to pile up.
Take a look at the nat'l welfare budget, realise it barely accounts for 2% (or some such) of the total budget, and then, look at the illiteracy rate (currently 22
... ask yourself why the imbalance?
okay... now, assuming that your idea of what is happening for those that are on welfare, understand that they are the exception, not the rule.
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Lastly I'm not defending Bush, I'm just getting tired of everyone bashing him as if hes the worst president we've ever had. Hes not that distinction belongs to Mr.Clinton.
Clinton:
- balanced budgets
- 100,000 more police
- violent and property crime dropping every year he was in office (as opposed to increases for the 12 years previous).
- Rebuilt Military (ie, Cheney himself said you go to war with your predecessor's military).
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and go ahead bring up his campaign finances, doesn't bother me but I bet you wont find where he took money from a foreign govt or as payoff money for pardons.
Jack, read House of Bush, House of Saud by Craig Unger. He, his father, his brother and most of his administration have very, very deep ties to Foreign powers and accepted huge sums of money from them.
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Bush may be alot of these but at least he didn't sell out our country to get elected or pardon convicted criminals either.
He's sold out the country left and right to foreign interests, his political party, his religion... you name it. The Republican party was deftly instrumental in holding up legislation that would make it a felony to pull scams like those that (were perpetrated by heavy Bush-Cheney 00 contributors) Enron and World Com.
No.. that's not sketchy at all.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
GAM is a pimp. Jackalope, bush is a shady @!#$. If you maybe even would possibly think to consider clinton the "worst president ever", read a little bit more about other presidents (both bush's in particular). GAM, damn dude, everything i'm thinking you say, hats off to you.
Wow, did I just get a case of deja vu for like the millionth time? And it always seems to end with Gam the Kilted One pulling "facts" out to prove a point that really has no point. Hey guess what! George Bush is still human just like everyone of us. He makes mistakes, and I'm tired of hearing the "Well he runs the country, he shouldn't make mistakes" BS I always hear. Whatever. Until the first "perfect person that doesn't make any mistakes" is created, everyone needs to just take a freaking break. Until you can run for president, and successfully campaign your way to the top, you can bite it.
And this isn't aimed at you GAM. I just needed your name for the point at the beginning. No hard feelings.
ShiftyCav wrote:thats probably the dumbest thing i have ever heard. you should take that serpentine belt and wrap it around your neck.
Quote:
Hes been on the cover of time magazine more than any other president. Why because he has the balls to go against the popular will and do what he feels is right. Right or wrong he is a leader of the people, not a leader for the people.
no b/c he is a complete DUMBA$$, i dont believe he knows when he is being made fun of.
maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow....... but some day
Joe: Being human isn't the problem, it's the fact that there's a general sense that he's either too much of a bleeding moron to be for real or that he's having his strings pulled by people that don't want to you have the opportunity to get at THEIR money.
Don't worry about using my name... I'm usually the loudmouth-pompous ass of the group anyhow...
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
Joe: Everyone is human. I think somebody that should be the president cannot be willing to sacrifice alot of lives for money. That is my main beef
Sorry Gam I've read the facts involving Clinton and I haven't forgotten what he had done.
I know you love the man and thats cool but to say the Chinese would have gotten it anyway so whats the difference is a trip! And do to the fact that he was dis-barred for his participation in illegal activities in his home state and the campaign monies from other governments and you have no problem with that is hysterical !! Then you talk about how Bush has sold out the country ?? Dude that makes no sense at all !! Keep defending him thats fine if you enjoy living in this delusional world where Clinton is great then by all means enjoy, But when you want to come back to reality then perhaps you'll begin to recognize that even tho Bush is indeed an idiot that Clinton was much, much worse.
I invite you to try and dismiss these facts involving Clinton as no big deal.
Semper Fi SAINT. May you rest in peace.
Jack, i just can't bring myself to agree with you. What clinton did was make some money for something that wasn't harming our country. Like was said before, it's not like we were selling them big secrets that only we had. Just simply making some money on somewhat common knowledge. They could have bought the same thing from the russians, we just made the money off of it. Bush sends boys to die so that he can gain financially, and the country can sink. Thats it. Clintons selling that @!#$ went straight into our economy, bush sucks money out of the economy to go to war so that money can go into his pocket. You still need to check the spelling on your sig skipper.
I look at it like this: Clittn' mistake is thathe didn't get the dress dry-cleaned...and if hillary was the tough old broad people make her out to be she would have divorced his ass.
Bush's mistake is that he showed more intrest in invading Iraq than he did for the Katrina disaster, and in at least one international circle, made the U.S. news about him become their Comedy Central.
But really, Clinton sucked, bush sucks, reagan sucked, bush sr. sucked, carter sucked, ford sucked, nixon sucked, johnson sucked, JFK sucked, et-@!#$-al.
Stop prepondering the small--it doesn't matter if they're democrat or republingan--your @!#$ will be bleeding the same when they're done with you. End of story.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Thats true, but i'm just saying the lesser of the two evils is by no means bush.
Voting for the lesser of two evils is still voting for evil; remember that.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Jackalope wrote:
The main problem with China in case your not up on current affairs is the way they are
now the #1 nuclear threat to the U.S. and they wouldn't be that threat right now if good old Bill hadn't provided them with the weapons guidance technology that only the U.S. and the Soviets had at the time.
.
In those times the Soviets would have done just the same if we said no. Difference is the during 80's we gave China a large amount of jobs that used to be here (Remember that tax break if you build outside the US by Reagan), the country is having a economic boom because of of us. And thanks to China they are now buying our products as well, which in turn helped lower our national dept in the 90's. So because we gave jobs to China they now have disposable income to spend on weapons provided by the Russia mostly and not the US.
In other words... Give thanks to Reagan for China'a big economic boom.
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And yup I like less taxes too. Does that make me an evil money grubbing miser? No that just makes me someone who sick and tired of the new democratic parties way of trying to suck as much as 50% out of the pockets of hard working people and I'm sorry if thats fine with you but its not with me! Where did I get the 50% number from?
And yes less taxes is good, but when you are running up a useless deficit like Reagan, Bush Jr did, your only result to payback that debt is by raising taxes. This is where Clinton did well here, we were actually paying the debt, getting a surplus and like I stated before in 2012 it was predicted the debt was going to be paid off. Once the debt is paid off, you can lower the taxes. But if run you up costs i.e. Iraq war, "Starwars," etc you are reluctant to raise taxes to pay it off.
In other words... Reagan and Bush spent like democrats, but the actual work was all republican (useless spending). Clinton spent like a democrat, but actual work was spent like a democrat in internal US gov't jobs--- Police, Firefighters, postal workers, etc.
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Hilliary Clinton herself said in a speech that the democratic led govt. knows how to spend the peoples money better then they do. Sounds an awful lot like communism to me.
Before putting labels know about the subject. Read Karl Marx's book and put it into context to what has happened in the world and you will see communism was by the definition of the creator Karl Marxs never put into practice anywhere in the world.
What you are implying what Hillary said maybe consider socialist, but not communist. Lastly, what she meant is the health care Social Security by the gov't, which is better then Bush's plan of you keeping it and eventually making you spend it on the stock market, as there the only ones benefiting is the corporate top.
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I work hard for what I have and I don't see why I should have to pay all these welfare cases to sit around and push out more mouths to feed. They need to get a job and stop depending on the govt to take care of them like they are children. Its not the govts job to provide for these lazy asses its their own. Cut out all these welfare programs and see how much cash starts to pile up.
I agree put them in jobs too and that was Clinton was doing, lots of gov't jobs as stated before. By having them work, they don't have to apply for welfare. But like I stated before, Bush Jr came into power those jobs ceased in order to pay for the Iraq war. Then when Reagan was in power, many factory jobs went over seas. Now those workers only option is welfare.
Yes, they can look for other job fields but most either left to Mexico, China, India or the next job will not pay the salary to support a family like the old factory used to pay. Do you see a trend here?
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Lastly I'm not defending Bush, I'm just getting tired of everyone bashing him as if hes the worst president we've ever had.
The man has done nothing right for this country, what he did do right is his priorities.
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Hes not that distinction belongs to Mr.Clinton. and go ahead bring up his campaign finances, doesn't bother me but I bet you wont find where he took money from a foreign govt or as payoff money for pardons.
If you want to attack him, attack him on issues that are legit and real. One of which was Rwanda case, as he turned his back on them and his administration in turn did not do squat for so long. There is a issue the Clinton did not do right.
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Bush may be alot of these but at least he didn't sell out our country to get elected or pardon convicted criminals either.
Reagan has done so much damage to this country at our cost and we are still tasting the the after taste of him. And Bush just gave us another dose of Reaganomics if you so forgotten.
These two clowns put this great country into downward spiral and yet its blind people like you that put them on a pedestal just because of the label/party they represent.
As for "Bush did not sell out the country to get elected," no he just sold out the country to fulfill his main goal and interest.
But wait... he is a "righty" so he must be good, correct?
THE POLITICALLY INCORRECT ONE.
Jackalope wrote:Sorry Gam I've read the facts involving Clinton and I haven't forgotten what he had done.
It seems that you had... Just reminding you, he gets a bad rap... just figured it be worth it to point out he did more than just poke an intern.
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I know you love the man and thats cool but to say the Chinese would have gotten it anyway so whats the difference is a trip!
I don't love the man... I'd only go gay for Borsty or NJHK. okay.. maybe Clinton if I got a bit of Chelsea.
Seriously, I think he gets slagged more than he's due.
And, China had the capacity to develop and manufacture all the guidance systems they need, or, buy from Russia, or, buy from Britain, or steal the plans and just do it themselves. Why not make a profit on it? Now before you go off... understand that the guidance systems were made for launching of civillian (or space installation) cargo rockets. There's a big difference between that, and a system that accepts mid-flight course corrections to a target on the ground. One is meant to put cargo into space, one is meant to arc over the earth, and re-enter the atmosphere, whilst simultaneously correcting for wind shear, and oh yeah... working flawlessly after going through the ionisation effects of re-entry.
In short: The guidance systems that you're getting in a huff about aren't compatible with a re-entry, so they can't be used to direct an ICBM... besides, China has had ICBMs since the 60's capable of striking the US left coast over the pacific or on Washington D.C. by coming over the pole.
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And do to the fact that he was dis-barred for his participation in illegal activities in his home state and the campaign monies from other governments and you have no problem with that is hysterical !!
If you're talking about White Water, no, you have the facts wrong.. it's a land deal that went askew. In direct response to him being disbarred: he wasn't. Not in Arkansas, he volunteered to not accept or try cases in Arkansas for 5 years, and he (along with a lot of other lawyers) cannot bring a case to the US supreme court. FYI, he's not been practising law since 1982. Roo-rah.
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Then you talk about how Bush has sold out the country ?? Dude that makes no sense at all !!
Spare me the trip down the last 5 years of idiocy.. please? Bush hasn't managed to get the job done at all. How do you justify a 1.2 trillion dollar increase (10
in national defecit (not just debt... this is called missing your interest payments ) year-over-year for the last 3 years running? How do you justify ignoring scads of information about 9/11/01? How do you justify lying to the people and sending soldiers to their needless deaths in Iraq? How do you justify a cost of living increase of over 20% since 2001?
Who sold out again?
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Keep defending him thats fine if you enjoy living in this delusional world where Clinton is great then by all means enjoy, But when you want to come back to reality then perhaps you'll begin to recognize that even tho Bush is indeed an idiot that Clinton was much, much worse.[/qoute]
He was an idiot that got the books balanced, got crime under control, and even pulled the country out of a recession that GHW Bush touched off. If that's an idiot, and Dubya is something else, I'd like to ask you what kind of reality challenge you have, Jack...
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I invite you to try and dismiss these facts involving Clinton as no big deal.
I'm not dismissing them at all.. far from it. I'm putting the facts of the matter on the table. He wasn't the best president you could have, no, certainly, but he's a league and a half above Dubya.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
[quote=Keeper of the Light™]Voting for the lesser of two evils is still voting for evil; remember that.
Haha I liked that one....good call in many cases.
ShiftyCav wrote:thats probably the dumbest thing i have ever heard. you should take that serpentine belt and wrap it around your neck.
Damn..pwned by the quotes...
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
man you make such a good point. but yeah, no doubt in my mind bush is the shadies @!#$ of them all really if ya think about it. just like gam says. need-less death.
