Hitler: what do you think... - Page 3 - Politics and War Forum

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Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Thursday, December 01, 2005 7:28 PM on j-body.org
Quote:

Well, what did russia do to incur our wrath, other than being a superpower?

With the Communists vs the Capitalist propaganda that was spreading the tensions may very well have led to war... maybe not in 1945 but as early as the Berlin airlift the wrong move by either side would have started war... we walked a thin tightrope in the Cold War and its s miracle nothing triggered WW3...
Back to WW2, many Germans wanted to surrender to the "civilized" West as opposed to the Russians, who were in payback mode... with Stalin's intentions clear, I'm sure many a General condidered the scenario... probably Patton for sure
Quote:

The idea of the allies turning on Stalin was considered. The fact is Stalin had the numbers, the US didn't have the appetite (and didn't have the resources to do it without more help than the rest could offer) and Egland (and the commonwelth) were tapped out. That's why Stalin got half of Germany, nobody liked the idea, but nobody was in a position to argue.

Good point and it was true... but if it did happen I wonder if Japan would side with Russia for a short time just to keep the US tied up in the Pacific... the tired British, Americans, and a battered German army would be vulnerable to the Russian army in 1945... the Americans could not hope to get a strategic bomber force in range of Russian industry for months and the Russian armor in particular was far superior to Allied armor.





Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Thursday, December 01, 2005 7:37 PM on j-body.org
Patton was on his last legs anyhow.. he died... what, in 1946?

Anyhow.. about Germans and Russians, after Germany capitulated, Russia ended up with 1/3 of Berlin, and a little less than half of Germany. When the Russians invaded, apparently you couldn't walk on a sidewalk without seeing a Nazi Party uniform/armband bonfire somewhere on the street. If it weren't for the stubborness of Operation Barbarossa, Germany might well have kept the Russians at bay.





Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.


Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 02, 2005 6:01 AM on j-body.org
About the german technology being added to the American bomber fleet, it was actually the British who led in jet engine design; Germany led in airframes/aerodynamics.




"i promise we won't get drunk, and go out in boat in the dark, stand up in the boat and fire the gun into the air unless we have life jackets on."
Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 02, 2005 8:58 AM on j-body.org
GAM (The Kilted One) wrote:Patton was on his last legs anyhow.. he died... what, in 1946?

Anyhow.. about Germans and Russians, after Germany capitulated, Russia ended up with 1/3 of Berlin, and a little less than half of Germany. When the Russians invaded, apparently you couldn't walk on a sidewalk without seeing a Nazi Party uniform/armband bonfire somewhere on the street. If it weren't for the stubborness of Operation Barbarossa, Germany might well have kept the Russians at bay.



he died in a car accident.

he wanted to keep going, in to the USSR, but IKE stoped him.

Chris


"An appeal to arms and the God of hosts is all that is left us. But we shall not fight our battle alone. There is a just God that presides over the destinies of nations. The battle sir, is not of the strong alone. Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it almighty God. I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death."

Speech at the Second Virginia Convention at St. John's Church in Richmond, Virginia (23 March 1775) Patrick Henry


Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 02, 2005 10:39 AM on j-body.org


Imagine some British jet engines like those in the Meteor strapped to that thing or a Me-262... that could have been sweet

Also, the US P80 Shooting Star was being produced by 1945 and that was even better than the German 262... the Russians were years away from a jet fighter... they only were able to catch up because the damn Brits GAVE them a fully assembled stae-of-the-art jet engine (see MiG-15)




Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 02, 2005 10:41 AM on j-body.org

Now this, however, is the tank we'd have to fight... the IS-3




Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 02, 2005 11:09 AM on j-body.org
Taesch: I don't think it'd have been a wise decision to traipse on into Russia. Russian forces out numbered Allied forces what... 2:1?


Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.


Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 02, 2005 11:13 AM on j-body.org
again, spit, what did they DO, not this pseudo-McCarty propoganda bull@!#$. Russia would ahve had to have done SOMETHING in order for all of us to want to invade and perpetuate a war, especially since most knew we were their allies.


Goodbye Callisto & Skaši, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 02, 2005 8:06 PM on j-body.org
Spitfire: The Arado(The bomber you pictured) Was just one example of many, which were crazy advanced, and could've made an impact, if not for Hitler's tactical idiocy. These aircraft also include the Me262(Which Hitler wanted to use as a ground attack aircraft, instead of a fighter/interceptor), and the Dornier Do335(Fighter with 2 piston engines, one in front and one in back, instead of on the wings; this gave the thrust of 2 engines but the drag of one).



"i promise we won't get drunk, and go out in boat in the dark, stand up in the boat and fire the gun into the air unless we have life jackets on."
Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 02, 2005 10:10 PM on j-body.org
Okay, just had a thought... I believe I'm wrong on that picture, but I can't find a link to support it.

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't that 4 engine bomber a prototype, which later led to the 2 engine Arado 234. If my memory serves my correctly, they tried 4 engines before going with 2... The skid in place of laning gear are another tip off.

In either case, Hitler made some @!#$ty decisions on the deployment of aircraft and armor.




"i promise we won't get drunk, and go out in boat in the dark, stand up in the boat and fire the gun into the air unless we have life jackets on."
Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Saturday, December 03, 2005 10:10 AM on j-body.org
Yeah the 4-engined 234 was a prototype... the 2 engine bomber was used in action with both the take-off trolley and later landing gear... I guess the lack of landing gear saved weight and made room for bombs?

The Germans had ideas for alot of cool jets, including a flying wing and several rocket planes (the Me-163 made it into action)







Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Saturday, December 03, 2005 10:12 AM on j-body.org

yes the Do-335, one of the coolest WW2 planes




Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Sunday, December 04, 2005 12:01 PM on j-body.org
id be dead... my familys hungarian... he owned our ass... sad times..



Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Sunday, December 04, 2005 4:58 PM on j-body.org
^weren't the Hungarians "allies" or at least "not enemies" of the Germans in WW2?
unless your family was Jewish then I agree





Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Monday, December 05, 2005 10:28 AM on j-body.org
it eaven had an ejection seat.

Chris


"An appeal to arms and the God of hosts is all that is left us. But we shall not fight our battle alone. There is a just God that presides over the destinies of nations. The battle sir, is not of the strong alone. Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it almighty God. I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death."

Speech at the Second Virginia Convention at St. John's Church in Richmond, Virginia (23 March 1775) Patrick Henry


Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Monday, December 05, 2005 11:07 AM on j-body.org

Ju-287 prototype

Amerikabomber... pretty sweet looking, like a Superfortress

Ta-400 fantasy art





Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Tuesday, December 06, 2005 9:12 AM on j-body.org
That's pretty insane.. I've seen the 287 a bunch of times, but that is the first I've seen of the bomber... that thing looks crazy.




"i promise we won't get drunk, and go out in boat in the dark, stand up in the boat and fire the gun into the air unless we have life jackets on."
Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Tuesday, December 06, 2005 9:39 AM on j-body.org
Yeah I'm into WW2 aviation stuff and the German airforce is the most interesting just because they came up with, and even went as far as building alot of these wierd and fantastic aircraft... some of these things impress me in that they actually flew!




Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Wednesday, December 07, 2005 3:01 PM on j-body.org
Spitfire,

Finland, Romania and Hungary joined the Tri-partite Pact which was a pact that was originally signed by Germany, Japan and Italy in November 1940. I believe that Britian declared war on all of the countries who signed the pact shortly after this.

Hungary was essential in the defence of the Reich's outworks but most of the time the Hungarians were up against the daunting Red Army. General Horthy, the Hungarian dictator considered defection until Hitler kidnapped his son.

Hungary started negotiations with the Allies in early 1944, and was occupied by German forces just a few months later.











I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, thats as good as they are going to feel all day. ~ Dean Martin

Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Wednesday, December 07, 2005 5:07 PM on j-body.org
If the Nazi's won the civil war, I think I would know a lot more about history.

Kidding.... I agree that not too much would be different. I don't think that the US would have been over-taken even if the Nazi's took control of everything. Don't let the occupation of France fool you. The Nazzi's were not as powerful as their image projected. Strategically placed nukes would have made any country surrender at that time.
Besides.. what is France anyway? Weren't they over-thrown and occupied by the cub-scouts in 1986?



Cardomain|Myspace

Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Thursday, December 08, 2005 3:35 PM on j-body.org
Quote:

I don't think that the US would have been over-taken even if the Nazi's took control of everything.


You are not serious, right ???





I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, thats as good as they are going to feel all day. ~ Dean Martin


Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 09, 2005 5:33 AM on j-body.org
Dead serious. This was all durring the height of nuclear warfare funding.



Cardomain|Myspace

Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 09, 2005 5:53 AM on j-body.org
Quote:

I don't think that the US would have been over-taken even if the Nazi's took control of everything.

Interesting theory, but I just can't picture it not happening.







Re: Hitler: what do you think...
Friday, December 09, 2005 11:37 AM on j-body.org
From a military point of view, the defeat of the Germans by the Russians was the turning point of the war, it had nothing to do with the two A bombs that were dropped on Japan. Over two-thirds of the German army were involved in operation barbarossa and the Germans defeat in Russia meant that the Allies in the west had more chance of success against a smaller German force. Winston Churchill himself stated that it was the Russians who "tore the heart out of the German army."

It was Hitlers own fault that they lost the war in Russia. His advisors wanted to lauch the bulk of the attack on Moscow, but Hitler wouldn't have it. Hitler's mistake (due to his overconfidence) was the decision to attack Moscow, Leningrad and Stalingrad with three equal forces, instead of the bulk of the attack being centered on Moscow. Hitler underestimated the Russians and his troops were not properly supplied or equiped for the winter of 41/42 all because he thought they would be done in Russia before winter.

If Hitler would have listened to his advisors and this mistake was not made, Russia would have fallen to the Germans. With a victory in Russia many historians believe that it would have only been a matter of time before the battle of Britian was won by the Germans. After that, it would have been over.

Your argument is that (we had nuclear weapons so we would have won). They only started the Manhattan project in '42, the Germans attacked Russia in June of 41. By the time the United States was ready to drop the A bomb it was 1945, it would have been too little too late.











I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, thats as good as they are going to feel all day. ~ Dean Martin

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