oh and let me know how your online bachelors degree goes. Ive always wondered what those "get a bachelors degree for $20" programs were like. I might still have an email in my spam box for a masters degree if you're interested in doing that after?
Sunfire 2.2 wrote:oh and let me know how your online bachelors degree goes. Ive always wondered what those "get a bachelors degree for $20" programs were like. I might still have an email in my spam box for a masters degree if you're interested in doing that after?
Are you horribly retarded?
My 8 year old SUV costs more used then most new cavs...and runs better as well. Don't try to trash the kind of car i drive when it is much better than a @!#$ cav.
On top of that you don't know the reasoning behind me buying my jeep nor about my other cars. (Your forgetting about my silverado i just recently got rid of)
Oh yeah, my 20 dollar degree is working just fine. I guess if you want to get a 20 dollar degree from a spam mail thats up to you. I however, chose to get a degree, through an accredited college that offers online courses for people who have jobs... As for price, it costs me(well costs my employer) around the same as a psychical school because well thats what it is..I'm just doing my course work online.
Thank you for going through my registry to try and find things to bash me about. It shows how @!#$ stupid you are.
Would you like to try again?
Since it's Christmas, nobody will get warned for this juvenile flame-fest. Yet.
The topic at hand is sleepers, and their pros and cons. Personal attacks, if you're immmature enough to make OR respond to them, should take place in IMs, emails or ANYWHERE but in this forum.
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Sunfire 2.2 wrote:Bastardking3000 wrote:Sunfire 2.2 wrote:sounds like alot of the horsepower posers on this site. except, the only sleeper thing about their car is that its a boring old car in the end and people fall asleep when you try to tell them about it.
Umm ok sure...
its ok. I know the truth hurts.
Yeah sure the truth hurts - but I'm not hurting. Continue on oh great and wise master - teach us more...
I've never heard of this "part throttle" before. Does it just bolt on?
Well, this is starting to get better then I had expected.
Okay, defend yourselves all day long over this like chickens with their @!#$ heads cut off. Great, makes for a good read knowing I caused you to come back on me so hard. Perhaps poking a beehive with a stick is more fun then previously thought.
As for my choice in equipment, what the @!#$ do I have to type out to let you people know I mod a CAVALIER. It has Gr-2s and Sportlines for a reason. I'm in no financial or mental (lack thereof) state to start spending my measely life savings on an almost 7 year old, bottom of the totem pole GM. Don't get me wrong, I love my car but I also know as every minute passes by, the book value drops on these cars. You'll never make back the money you spent, but perhaps I could spend my money wisely or more diversely. Spending thousands on suspension because it's the best of the best wouldn't do anyting for me. My car is basically stock, therefore whether you care to believe so or not, yes the GR-2s and the Eibachs really changed the car for me and IMO handle great. As I've mentioned, I'm no expert but I'm not new to regulated racing and driving of a vehicle. Smoked headlights? God forbid I use spray paint on my car. They turned out great and are a ghetto alternative to the much more expensive black projectors. It's a F(#@&ING CAVALIER. I don't have much, if any, expendable monies to spend on the car. When I do, I don't dump all of it on just one particular area.
As for european lubricants and such, I've done my research. TUV approved motor oil is residing in my crank case. My coolant is regularly flushed, replaced and treated with temperature drop additive. Powersteering.. treated. Brakes regularly serviced, front ceramic pads. That car is in A1 mechanical condition. I'm slowly planning the neccessary bodyworkings to get it up to snuff.
PERFECT EXAMPLE: Alpine Audio demo vehicles. Sure, they could just fab up the most intense install into any old car and leave it looking somewhat original outside. More or less a sleeper in the audio industry. The clarity and hard pound coming from behind it's sheetmetal would let you know the car had some serious equipment. Good enough. Not. They're not famous for just putting speakers in a fibreglass enclosure. They're famous for completely transforming a car around it's products. Celebrities in the industry. They get extreme respect for thier finished products. The guy next to him may win the audio competition with a stock looking, rolling earthquake creator (should there be one), but people will remember the Alpine vehicle. More or less the same with an all-out drag race between a crazy modified car putting down a fair time as opposed to some base model car making the pass just that much quicker.
Who cares what you think?
Like was said earlier, its about personalization.
Who are you to say anything is right or wrong, good or bad?
Why do ppl mod cars with rust on them?
Ive never understood this, id rather have a 20 second car that matches and doesnt smell like @!#$ on the interior than a 10 second crusty junkpile
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
WannaBzee (aka BadAceDesign) wrote:Who cares what you think?
Like was said earlier, its about personalization.
Who are you to say anything is right or wrong, good or bad?
Exactly!!
Everyone is different...... and sometimes peoples tastes change...... anymore the more I look at bodykits, hoods, and spoilers, etc, I see blatant overkill in my opinion. I see like maybe 1 out of every 10 bodykits looks good. With my new car im being picky as all hell with it. Originally I was going to go with a stock looking car, and it would have looked great. In my opinion, some of the nicest cars on this site are sporting factory lip kits and spoilers with mild to no exterior work besides wheels and a drop.
Get off your high horse man... If you like your car better than his, good for you..... cause seriously why give a @!#$ if you dont drive it?
I love anything as long as its fast I could care less what it looks like, I drive a cavalier so obviously looks arent a big thing to me.
If you have more respect for the riced out body kits and huge wheels than you do boost+ VVT then you are either retarded or a true member of this site.
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Id rather have nice wheels than VVT, you know at least the wheels do something
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
^^
Other people build sleepers to put people like you to shame.
They had an article in SCC entitled "Cheap Speed" in which they took 5 different car models, all of which were not only highly modified, but were also done for about $5,000 or less. The most memorable car was a Dodge Omni that ran 12's I belive. Guy did it all with junk-yard parts and a little smarts. Thing was a total sleeper, but it was just an old fashioned Omni. No bling, no wing. Just plain, old fashioned know-how.
Don't get me wrong. I know where you're coming from, but you don't need to be such an ass about how you say it.
You want intelligent responses? Post an intelligent question, in the proper context, and then you can have discussion. Granted, it'll slip into an un-controlable flame fest in about a week, but before that you'll have good discussion.
Just to be clear. Sleeper does not mean rust bucket, or car in state of disrepair at all.
Sleeper means stock appearance, upgraded driveline (and usually brakes and suspension as well).
Some claim my Talon cannot be a sleeper because it looks fast. In my opinion, it is a sleeper because from the outside it looks like a plain Talon with nothing done. (I should update my registry). In reality it is not a "fast" Talon, but if a stock one wanted a go, it'd get beat. I'm up maybe 50 or 60 HP from stock, but you can't tell by looking at it, and to me, that is a sleeper (a mild one).
A better sleeper would be a 1974 Dodge Dart with a 440 dropped in. Or a Dodge Colt with a 4G63T transplant. Much better.
The point is, stock appearance does not mean old, unmaintained car, it means no show, all go.
Reasons, very good reasons.. Theft, Cop attention, employer opinion and customer opinion. I'm a service tech, showing up an a droped and chopped Civic would cost me in tickets (Cops love em), and in respect. The same reason I don't use my bike for work.
PAX
Alright, alright. I've got my warning. I'm not totally dense, perhaps I should be less aggressive in my own opinions. I apologize for that.
Also, JimmyZ did bring up a very good point. If you own a CLEAN, MAINTAINED sleeper in a shabby neighborhood it is less likely to draw unwanted attention from shady characters. Fair 'nuf. Location would have a pretty formidable impact on your vision for your ride. I live in a relatively quiet neighborhood without hardly an ounce of trouble. A highly modified vehicle in my driveway might not be much of a hassle here.
As for drawing attention from the local authorities.. I'd encourage it. I've learned my lessons in speeding and random acts of stupid. If I get pulled over here and there because I'm that noticable, I wouldn't be livid. Any mods I have planned would be all legal and well thought out/executed. I've been pulled over previously just for exhuast and drop. I left the side of the road after making nice with the officer and he actually asked what I've done and what my plans are. He thought it was cool to see a clean car with prospective plans in the future. That's not bad attention in my books.
If your concern is not being well recieved by employers.. I can understand that. There are alot of clean, modified rides that are not sleepers, but do not draw the same attention as a full show boater. JDM is a famous trend for that. There are body modified or different from stock vehicles that are really highly modified but are clean and subtle. Still fall under 'modified exterior'.
I guess I'm pretty indifferent to the sleepers, but now I understand other then going suicidally fast in a car perhaps not up to snuff. Most of the vehicles on the JBO get my respect, I appreciate the work all of you do in performance and in body, keeps the J alive. I just have personal distaste towards people who really do use 'sleeper' as an excuse to not take care of the vehicles appearance.
kidduntradishunal wrote:as far as I am concerned a car should look as fast as it is
After the first time you contradict yourself you should stop before you hurt yourself.
If you modify the exterior without modifying the engine your owning yourself there buddy.
Personally I'm not big on looks, my car looks nice, its mostly stock, besides performance mods, a stock looking stereo install and 17" rims.
There are no facts in modifying cars only opinions.
-Chris
Rodimus Prime wrote:Id rather have nice wheels than VVT, you know at least the wheels do something
Yea, what function do huge wheels have besides getting highschool girls wet?
I guess its all good though mane.
It just pisses me off when people do the whole showcar thing, Body kit and huge wheels and then try to race with thier only mod being a Speed chip they got off ebay.
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why do you care what someone else does to their car? wheather its rusted or not why does it matter to you? you say you can respect anyone that puts time into their car but you obviously cant. your friend put work into his motor and just because its rusted you think its a piece of crap. the whole point of the sleeper is to make people go
. ive seen a red blazer w/ green steelies run 13s. the whole purpose is to make people go
oh and before you start bashing other peoples car you should take a look at your own with your improper modding of your suspension. take some time and learn things before you start bashing other peoples rides.
Hahahaha wrote:Just to be clear. Sleeper does not mean rust bucket, or car in state of disrepair at all.
Sleeper means stock appearance, upgraded driveline (and usually brakes and suspension as well).
Some claim my Talon cannot be a sleeper because it looks fast. In my opinion, it is a sleeper because from the outside it looks like a plain Talon with nothing done. (I should update my registry). In reality it is not a "fast" Talon, but if a stock one wanted a go, it'd get beat. I'm up maybe 50 or 60 HP from stock, but you can't tell by looking at it, and to me, that is a sleeper (a mild one).
A better sleeper would be a 1974 Dodge Dart with a 440 dropped in. Or a Dodge Colt with a 4G63T transplant. Much better.
The point is, stock appearance does not mean old, unmaintained car, it means no show, all go.
Reasons, very good reasons.. Theft, Cop attention, employer opinion and customer opinion. I'm a service tech, showing up an a droped and chopped Civic would cost me in tickets (Cops love em), and in respect. The same reason I don't use my bike for work.
PAX
A stock looking Talon is a wicked sleeper because it's plausible that a "n00b" would bring it to a street race thinking it was fast. People get suspicious when a guy brings a brand new Dodge Caravan to a meet. But an 8 year old Talon? People believe it. You go dude *high five*
Sleepers have been kind of ruined by all the "bling bling" nowadays because to show up at a street race with 14" wheels calls more attention to itself than if you show up with some hideous winged monstrosity with a concert stereo system.
See, as a kid I didn't know about bling. Everyone I knew had about 7 cars in their backyards in various states of repair, a fully stocked garage, a pit and chainblocks. We considered the scrapyard our "Speed Shop" and would get all sorts of old crap cars that had been dumped there. Best ones were the old Chryslers with the 440's. Man those engines could run. Pop one of those into a Plymouth Volare and just GO! Even when the 440's smoked and took more oil than gas they could motor down a backwoods road like nobody's business. We also liked the 350's from trucks when put into a Chevy Monza or Vega, but it needed a lot more massaging than the 440. People may laugh at the toothless yokels redneck Dukes of Hazard MF's from my youth, but those guys knew cars like nobody's business. I always smile when I walk by a place and see an old 1984 CRX or a Dodge Omni Shelby sitting next to a chain block because I know that mechanical creativity didn't die with the onboard computer.
It's easy to get someone else to paint your car and install wings on it. It's easy to put old crappy 20" dubs on your ride. It's easy to change a stereo. How about changing a Hyundai Accent to a Tibuton V6 drivertrain? Not so easy now is it?
Don't put down sleepers, a lot of work went into them. Money doesn't buy everything.
A sleeper is to fool you and surprise you/take your money at the drag races. It's a no frills race car that is an uncommon style of car. Why build up a different type of car? They're usually cheaper to buy, have the surprise factor, and are usually cheap on insurance.
Go to your local drag strip and see how many cars have expensive candy paint jobs, blingin rims, bodykits, lambos, etc.... not many, if any cars will have that bs there. That's cool if you want all that bling to turn heads, but many would rather turn heads with a badass exhaust note or a fast 1/4 mile time.
When you go to the dragstrip what do you think people will talk about all day? A stock ls1 corvette running 13's... or a primered stock looking amc gremlin running 10's and basically showing up everyone there.
If you are so convinced that all that matters is how your car looks, rather than runs, why don't you go make a damn sculpture if you are so damn obsessive?
One of my dreams in life is to own a geo metro and swap a W41 into it with a 150 direct port kit on it. Why you ask? Because it would be a METRO that runs 11's. Where are you going to find a metro that looks cool/nice? You aren't. Because you couldnt make one if you wanted to. Where are you going to find that metro I described? Nowhere until I build it. Point, set, match.
K bye tnx!
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Maybe Im just pissed, pissed that my freinds are spineless, What else would you
call abandoment some night, when you're in a fight, and they could make things right?
Spineless. I miss some of my old friends, the ones who you could count on,
bet a huge amount on, the fact that they'd always have your back... Its like a kick in
the sack, just knowing, you've got nothing to fall back on. @!#$ this, Im done.
You can do wicked nasty things with a Geo Metro in Canada. We had Turbo 3 cylinder versions of that car, but since it's a tiny turbocharger and the 3 and 4 cylinder in those cars is identical, it's entirely possible to build an easy 130hp Metro using some very common parts. The only custom thing would be the exhaust header and that's about it. I figure maybe 1,500$ total. And if you strip that car of everything you could have a power/weight ratio equal to a Corvette. Nice huh?
I just wish people would get over what other people drive
seriously
yep, i have a friend of a friend that my buddies uncle happens to know
well he owns a Dodge Caravan , forget what year , but it's just a plain ole cargo van, apparently that thing i'll snap the hulk's neck of the line and dust just about everything it runs against ,and,......... get this, he can actually sleep in it ... a true " sleeper " .
People seem to miss the point.
I hate "rice" and when I see someone with it I laugh at it. But I dont go otu of my way to tell the person their car sucks. I might take a picture, but im not going to cut them off. Many people with ugly body kits Ill at least try to have a conversation with, and some actually say something intelligent about motors or suspension, and we can talk about that. Others fit the stereotypes and I move on. Point is......
Whatever you want ot believe about someones car just leave it to your self. Find something better to do with your time than to get all flustered about what someone else drives.
If you have to ask on a internet forum that you don't understand something, no amount of posts are going to make you understand, you have already made up in your mind what you want to believe.
