Acer wrote:Hahahaha wrote:Reports I hear are that they taunted and tortured him all night before his hanging. The woke him every half hour, they showed him the noose and said "it's waiting for you" repeatedly and even when he was trying to pray in his last few moments they shouted the name of his enemies at him.
Let me be clear that I am against capitol punishment but I respect that the people he affected had the right to try and if convicted exercise whatever punishment. I feel shame for humankind that these barbarous practices are still going on. Taking a life will never give anything back. That said, I still respect their right to hang the man, and yes, he was a tyrant.
Could they not allow him to at least have a desent death? Could they not allow him to say his final prayers without the behaviour described? They proved, in front of us all, they they are no better than the man they hung. They should be very ashamed. Oh yes, a muslim guy I know said they killed him on a religious day as well. He said it'd be like killing a Christian on Christmas day.. Nice.. Really nice.
PAX
I didnt hear of all that...
I haven't either - but that doesn't make it true or untrue. I'll wait for the facts to sort themselves out before I make that judgement call though. But I swear it seems like at least half the year is some muslim holy day, holy week, or holy month, or another etc. I wouldn't be suprised if I heard about them having a holy years lol. Besides I'm sure that some Sunni Muslims where killing Shiite Muslims and vice versa on that same holy day.
I've never heard of this "part throttle" before. Does it just bolt on?
degenerated wrote:Quote:
Taking a life will never give anything back.
I don't ever think that was the point of captial punishment. It's to get rid of someone who doesn't deserve to live.
Putting him in jail forever will never get anything back either, what's your point? What would your solution be?
Jail or exile... both perfectly valid.
I don't agree with killing someone who killed wholesale it just cheapens life further. As much as I don't agree with the execution, I'd rather see Iraqis determine their own course... if it means murdering a murderer, then that's their call.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
Quote:
Taking a life will never give anything back.
Nonsense... Saddam's will be pushing up daisy's - or perhaps other flowers. I think Iraq needs more flowers. It's a good thing...
I've never heard of this "part throttle" before. Does it just bolt on?
Knoxfire wrote:It was the first day of Eid ul-Adha. It's not really like Xmas though.
Eid ul-Adha (Arabic: عيد الأضحى ‘Īd al-’Aḍḥā
occurs on the tenth day of the Islamic month of Dhul Hijja. It is one of two Eid festivals that Muslims celebrate. Eid ul-Adha is celebrated by Muslims worldwide as a commemoration of Prophet Ibrahim's (Abraham's) willingness to sacrifice his son Ismael for God. Like Eid ul-Fitr, Eid ul-Adha also begins with a short prayer followed by a sermon (khuṭba).
It is celebrated on the 10th day of the month of Dhul Hijja (ذو الحجة of the lunar Islamic calendar, after Hajj, the annual pilgrimage to Mecca in Saudi Arabia. This happens to be approximately 70 days after the end of the month of Ramadan.
Eid ul-Adha is three days long starting the day after the pilgrims in hajj (annual pilgrimage to Mecca by Muslims world wide) descend from mount Arafat.
Men, women, and children are expected to dress in their finest clothing and perform prayer (Salat) in any Masjid (mosque). Muslims who can afford to do so sacrifice their best domestic animals (usually sheep, but also camels, cows, and goats) as a symbol of Ibrahim's (Abraham's) sacrifice.
Saddam was just another sacrifice. Although I doubt they gave his meat to the poor.
Just found out something "interesting" about that - that the Sunni "Eid al-Adha" started the day Saddam was killed but that the Shiite version starts the day after - so they where kinda poking the Sunnis in the eye there. Aren't they supposed to be PREVENTING sectarian fighting?
Also...
article wrote:It was also carried out extra-constitutionally. The constitution requires a death sentence to have the signature of the president and two vice presidents, each representing one of the three major ethnic groups in the country (Sunni, Shiite and Kurd). That provision is meant to prevent sectarian killings. The president did not sign. Nouri al-Maliki contrived some work-around.
and...
Quote:
Finally, there was the motley crew -- handpicked by the government -- that constituted the hanging party. They turned what was an act of national justice into a scene of sectarian vengeance. The world has now seen the smuggled video of the shouting and taunting that turned Saddam Hussein into the most dignified figure in the room -- another remarkable achievement in burnishing the image of the most evil man of his time.
Worse was the content of the taunts: "Moqtada, Moqtada," the name of the radical and murderous Shiite extremist whose goons were obviously in the chamber. The world saw Hussein falling through the trapdoor, executed not in the name of a new and democratic Iraq but in the name of Moqtada al-Sadr, whose death squads have learned much from Hussein.
The source for that info - note that it is an opinion column.
Still... anyone get the opinion that the "Iraq government" is really just the Shiite government at this point? Yeah that is sure to stop the infighting between Sunni and Shiite REEEEEEEEEEEEAL SOON. Worse is that is the fact that this is government that we're backing - a government ran predominently by Shiites who are openly and blantantly fanning the flames. Maybe part of our Iraq stratagy needs to be doing something about this new government.
I've never heard of this "part throttle" before. Does it just bolt on?
GAM (The Kilted One) wrote:
Jail or exile... both perfectly valid.
neither of those options are valid today. 200 years ago with napoleon, maybe. but with 24 hour news, the internet, etc there is no way exiling saddam would have been a good idea. one of two things would have happened: 1--supporters find him and reinstate him as their leader (not nec. in iraq) and he continues with his mass murders etc. or 2--he would have been hunted by people that didnt like him, eventually being caught, beaten, tortured, and eventually killed. hanging him is much more humane than allowing this or allowing him to return to power.
and jail for life? how does that solve anything? sure he isnt in power....but he isnt exactly punished either. sitting in a jail cell, getting cable, 3 meals a day, etc is luxurious compared to death. it shows any prospective killer that they can get away with murder, literally. the only way to deal with someone such as that is to kill them. then it is final. they wont be able to do anything else. and just because hes in jail doesnt mean he will stay there. all it would take is for his supporters to gain power and release him. iraq is still very politically turbulent and we cant say what will or wont happen in its future.
lets not forget another prisoner who was released from jail by political supporters: hitler. all jail did for him was increased his notoriety as well as allowed him respite enough to collect all of his thoughts into a little book called
mein kampf. even though the situations are not exactly the same, we can see similarities and draw conclusions from them.
I'd like all executions to be broadcast on public TV.
I want the public to be face to face with the reality of the death penalty.
---
Hell ya.. Make them watch, see how they feel about it then.
They should not just be broadcast, they should interupt all media, nobody sees a movie or watches TV without seeing it.
PAX
^^^When you have people like me that are a bit disaffected by it, it won't do any good.
I see where you're going, but having saw the bloody thing on broadcast TV, it really didn't affect me at all.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
That's only part of the point.
Somehow its' the general consensus that it's bad taste to show him dying, but it's not bad taste to want him hanged?
That's the big point.
---
Okay...now, unlike the pervert on the subway, i have brushed up against the salient point, and have penetrated it
I have to agree then--any bastard you want kiklled in a certain way, you should at least have the constitution to stick around and watch them die that way, otherwise you violate Evil Overlord rule CXXV:
Should I actually decide to kill the hero in an elaborate escape-proof deathtrap room (water filling up, sand pouring down, walls converging, etc.) I will not leave him alone five-to-ten minutes prior to "imminent" death, but will instead (finding a vantage point or monitoring camera) stick around and enjoy watching my adversary's demise.
And we all know what hapens if you leave the hero to die without watching it...they escape and rally against you.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
AGuSTiN wrote:I'd like all executions to be broadcast on public TV.
I want the public to be face to face with the reality of the death penalty.
thats a little one sided, isnt it? to balance that you would also have to show the person murdering or raping or whatever violent act got them on death row to begin with.
CavFire (tabs) aka tabasco wrote:AGuSTiN wrote:I'd like all executions to be broadcast on public TV.
I want the public to be face to face with the reality of the death penalty.
thats a little one sided, isnt it? to balance that you would also have to show the person murdering or raping or whatever violent act got them on death row to begin with.
very well said!
|Forged 8.9:1 Wiseco Pistons|Forged Eagle Rods|HPTuners|60trim|Tial Wastegate|
|Precision Intercooler|2.5" Exhaust|2.5" Charge Pipes|630CC Mototron Injectors|
|Stock: Fuel Pump, Transmission, Manifold, TB, Head, Head Gasket, Ignition, Suspension...|
AGuSTiN wrote:I'd like all executions to be broadcast on public TV.
I want the public to be face to face with the reality of the death penalty.
The only way THAT will happen is when they're strapped onto the gurney with the needles in their arm.
IF you want to see the reality of an execution for yourself, join noose club... otherwise, trust me, death sucks. Seeing someone die of natural causes or from an accident (I've seen it enough) sucks and taints you in ways you can't shake off to begin with, and seeing someone put to death... well... Watch some drunk ass
hole stomp a dog to death. Same principle.
Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.
Too true. I have been first on scene to a horrid motorcycle accident in which my friend was killed in such a way that I didn't realize who it was for quite a few minutes, and I have seen a fatal accident happen first hand, right in front of me.. Both of those events were more than 15 years ago and I recall every little detail. Not because I want to, but because I can't shake it.
PAX
CavFire (tabs) aka tabasco wrote:AGuSTiN wrote:I'd like all executions to be broadcast on public TV.
I want the public to be face to face with the reality of the death penalty.
thats a little one sided, isnt it? to balance that you would also have to show the person murdering or raping or whatever violent act got them on death row to begin with.
Considering the incredible amount of people on Death Row that have been exhonerated before OR after being put to death, that wouldn't always be possible now, would it?
---
^^^ it would only be possible if there happened to be a camera filming the crime, and that isnt often. and even when it happens, its usually a crappy security camera--not nearly the same equipment that NBC or other news channels use.
all i was saying was that you cant be fair by showing the one side w/o showing the other. sure lots of people dont like capital punishment. but it seems that many of those people suggest televising executions as a way to get rid of it. all im saying is that you would need to show a rape or murder to show people WHY the inmate was being executed. without that a televised execution is sure to slant opinion away from capital punishment because all you are seeing is the law officials pulling a switch and a guy being fried.
to keep this more on point, by itself just showing a random person (in our case saddam) hung would be out of context. but if you could also see the beaten, bloodied bodies of the people he has tortured and killed and then show him being hanged it allows it to be in context. it would show ACTION>REACTION.
Well I guess then you had better also do all the background and finsd out why the kliller became the way he/she is. Or perhaps the killing is some kind of revenge.. Whatever.. The fact is that showing the crime would still not tell the story.
PAX
what i suggested might not show everything from the beginning but it will show the action and reaction. from there its a complete segment of the story, if not the complete story itself
There is always a reason. Even what looks to be a random act of violence has some history behind it.
I know a man who committed double homicide. He is now a 6 figure logistics manager who has not commited any other crimes (as far as I know) and is a good productive member of society. He has value and is no risk. He is free only because of the context of the murders.
Everything has context.
PAX
sure everything has context....context is merely the circumstances surrounding a particular event. it doesnt mean that the event was justified or right. saddam killed thousands of kurds. he wanted power and didnt want any dissention. thats the context in which those murders took place.
but in the end, we make our decisions and cannot blame others for those decisions. yes there will always be extinuating circumstances. there are need crimes and there are greed crimes. but it seems that everyone wants to point the finger at anyone but themselves. i believe criminals need to be punished. and i believe dangerous criminals should be punished more severely.
i watched the video and enjoyed watching saddam die
its all how you look at it and its your own opinion
You take a women and X her by PSI devide the legs and you can then juice the car......LOL
Reading through and learning that Saddam was taunted prior to his death I'd have to say I'm a little sickened. Yes, I enjoyed watching him die mostly from the fact that now he can't come into power again. But I'm sickened by the way the Iraqis handled his death. He obviously wasn't treated humainly before he died and it was a one-sided hanging. I appreciate knowing that he is dead, and the video is only necessary for those who can't believe he's dead on what the papers say but I agree with Hahahaha
Quote:
Could they not allow him to at least have a desent death? Could they not allow him to say his final prayers without the behaviour described? They proved, in front of us all, they they are no better than the man they hung. They should be very ashamed. Oh yes, a muslim guy I know said they killed him on a religious day as well. He said it'd be like killing a Christian on Christmas day.. Nice.. Really nice.
*****************************************************
*
* Student of the University of Oklahoma. Go Sooners!
*
*****************************************************
