Why argue about faith? - Page 2 - Politics and War Forum

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Re: Why argue about faith?
Tuesday, September 02, 2008 10:14 AM on j-body.org
Many people believe in an infinite number of universes which would imply that every conceivable combination of events happened in at lease one of them.
This would mean that there is one in which there was a creator who's only son died for the sins of others? A world in which the miracles happened just as written in a book 2000 years ago, but there is not and will never be any proof of them happening.

Other universes may have miracles happening everyday and therefore the majority believe in a divine being with only a few who disbelieve because of their hardheadedness.

Of course this one could also could be one in which death is just death and we only have nothingness to look forward to.

That would also mean that there is a universe in which Rodimus gets laid everyday (by a female). OK, maybe I'm stretching it a bit :-)



Believe what you want, but allow others to do the same without scoffing at them.

Re: Why argue about faith?
Tuesday, September 02, 2008 12:10 PM on j-body.org
^^^In that argument you're still negating Christianity since God is supposted to be paramount to the universe, or any of it's parallels.

But getting back to the topic at hand, It's because humans can't comprehend the fact that two at-odds and conflicting ideas can both be right, and both be wrong within the same 2 second time frame, and they can't comprehend outside of their own relative point of view and feel that those that do not share the same circumstances of their own happiness are unhappy, when in reality the circumstances of said happines can often lead to unhappiness.

And lastly, GAM, you forgot about the British conscripting american sailors at sea. That was more fuel to the fire starting the war. The naked land grab of canada, which worked about as well as this war in restoring peace to Iraq thus far, was just icing on the cake. Also, it was a British garrison, not canadians, that primarily laid torch to the whitehouse. Saying it was the Canadians and no other would be like saying the US won WWI for the allies.




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Re: Why argue about faith?
Tuesday, September 02, 2008 2:52 PM on j-body.org
The British Garrison was made up entirely of Canadian-born Loyalists with the exception of the Officer corps. Why do you think that the letter C was a hard commodity to come by in Washington

Conscripting American Sailors was entirely ok by the King at the time... if you were on the seas, you were on your own. 3 Privateers to a single Hove... the odds weren't great. If you were in a British port, you were a subject of the King as well.




Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.


Re: Why argue about faith?
Wednesday, September 03, 2008 12:13 PM on j-body.org
Either way, the whole 1812 war was screwed up. We try a naked land grab and get beaten back, you come in, led by Britain, burn the whitehouse, only to have the bit sheat out of you by Mother nature, and we effectively win the last battle of the war after the peace try was signed...

I seiously doubt another war was as messed up as this...well, with the exception of the current iraq conflict.



Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Re: Why argue about faith?
Wednesday, September 03, 2008 1:56 PM on j-body.org
[quote=Keeper Of The Light™ (Strazca)]Either way, the whole 1812 war was screwed up. We try a naked land grab and get beaten back, you come in, led by Britain, burn the whitehouse, only to have the bit sheat out of you by Mother nature, and we effectively win the last battle of the war after the peace try was signed...

I seriously doubt another war was as messed up as this...well, with the exception of the current iraq conflict.Well, seeing as how Gilligan's regime is gonna get changed pretty soon (Hopefully the Senate and Congress stay democrat or at least conservative anti-Bush and they begin a Quickie Impeachment hearing, trial and removal of Bush... why? Remember when he campaigned in 2000 as the "responsibility candidate?" Well, just to prove he's truly a man of his word even if by accident. Also, I want to see how Cheney deals with the monster f**k ups left in the wake of Dubya-ism, I'm sure there's gonna be a few new profanities and 4 letter words made up over those 48 hours.)




Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.


Re: Why argue about faith?
Wednesday, September 03, 2008 3:42 PM on j-body.org
Somehow I think that the reelection of some other yo-yo that thinks they know what their doing will change very little.

Anyhow, back to the topic--where people need to argue about faith because they can't comprenend that want makes them happy doesn't make everyone happy.


Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Re: Why argue about faith?
Wednesday, September 03, 2008 4:53 PM on j-body.org
True that.

Most "evangelicals" are witnessing for their religion (note: I didn't say their faith). And while I can deal with that, I'm not a fan pushing it on people.

I'm not gonna lie, I don't think that ANY religion has it totally right. I'm pretty sure that "Be good, and just" is a mantra that everyone can deal with... Even born-again Christians that fail their way to the top...




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Re: Why argue about faith?
Thursday, September 11, 2008 8:48 AM on j-body.org
i dont see Christian conservatives much different than Muslim extremists, they want to impose their will on everyone else and make their religion the absolute law



1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85





Re: Why argue about faith?
Thursday, September 11, 2008 8:53 PM on j-body.org
**wrong post


Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Thursday, September 11, 2008 8:55 PM

"An appeal to arms and the God of hosts is all that is left us. But we shall not fight our battle alone. There is a just God that presides over the destinies of nations. The battle sir, is not of the strong alone. Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it almighty God. I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death."

Speech at the Second Virginia Convention at St. John's Church in Richmond, Virginia (23 March 1775) Patrick Henry


Re: Why argue about faith?
Friday, September 12, 2008 12:36 AM on j-body.org
Rodimus Prime wrote:i dont see Christian conservatives much different than Muslim extremists, they want to impose their will on everyone else and make their religion the absolute law
That statement is pretty much true IMO. But remember that they don't represent Christianity nor Christians as a whole. And when it boils down to it, what they are saying doesn't sound all that different than what radical Muslims say - they basically change the nouns around.




Naturally the common people don't want war; neither in Russia, nor in England, nor in
America, nor in Germany. That is understood. But after all, it is the leaders of the
country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along,
whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist
dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the
leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and
denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the
same in any country. - Hermann Goring

Re: Why argue about faith?
Monday, September 15, 2008 3:52 PM on j-body.org
Unfortunattely, it seems against human nature to be good, just, and more importantly not f-ing with everyone else.

Debating faith IMHO is a fun mental excercize, but only if not taking seriously. It's like any other debate--you sstate your premise, people question the grey areas, and you try to shore up those grey areas without leaving gaping holes or doubling back on yourself.

If it's taken seriously, when people spout personal noumenon as absolute phenomina (I.E. "God/the bible says so", or spouting of an unporven scientific theory, for example), is when it goes into the @!#$ter.

The biggest issue in this is people's self-esteem. They can't stand the possibility of not being right. Moreover, they look at the possible disproving of their beliefs as a possible end of life as a point of transcending to a greter understanding--especially since a religion, faith, or a belif system is only defined personally by one's experience. Negating experience IMHO stifles personal development, and is possibly a reason IMHO why adulthood is just taller preschool.


Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.

Re: Why argue about faith?
Monday, September 15, 2008 6:45 PM on j-body.org
[quote=Keeper Of The Light™ (Strazca)]Unfortunattely, it seems against human nature to be good, just, and more importantly not f-ing with everyone else.

Debating faith IMHO is a fun mental excercize, but only if not taking seriously. It's like any other debate--you sstate your premise, people question the grey areas, and you try to shore up those grey areas without leaving gaping holes or doubling back on yourself.

If it's taken seriously, when people spout personal noumenon as absolute phenomina (I.E. "God/the bible says so", or spouting of an unporven scientific theory, for example), is when it goes into the @!#$ter.

The biggest issue in this is people's self-esteem. They can't stand the possibility of not being right. Moreover, they look at the possible disproving of their beliefs as a possible end of life as a point of transcending to a greter understanding--especially since a religion, faith, or a belif system is only defined personally by one's experience. Negating experience IMHO stifles personal development, and is possibly a reason IMHO why adulthood is just taller preschool.
Yep I agree with what you said there - especially about people being wrong about something. That is not exclusive to faith. For most people, the surest and quickest way to piss people off is to simply say or imply that they are wrong - about ANYTHING - and that lights a fire.

My personal theory is that this is related to "survival of the fittest" instinct - and being wrong ever is somehow a sign of inferiority - or at least it seems so in people's minds. Everyone is right about everything and if you tell them otherwise then you are a total idiot - if not evil.

No where is that more prevalent than when discussing religion and/or politics(where as to many people hold their political beliefs on an almost religious level - If the great prophet Rush Limbaugh or the Chosen One Al Gore say so then it IS true).




Naturally the common people don't want war; neither in Russia, nor in England, nor in
America, nor in Germany. That is understood. But after all, it is the leaders of the
country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along,
whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist
dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the
leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and
denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the
same in any country. - Hermann Goring

Re: Why argue about faith?
Monday, September 15, 2008 7:02 PM on j-body.org
Came across this today: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77-6OMB50Vo




11 speaker JL Audio stereo setup for sale:
http://www.j-body.org/classifieds/audio/52021/

Re: Why argue about faith?
Tuesday, September 16, 2008 10:47 AM on j-body.org
Touché, BK3K, about the political dogma being comparable to religious dogma.

You're not weak and inferior if you're wrong--you're weak and inferior if you can't deal with being wrong.


Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Re: Why argue about faith?
Tuesday, September 16, 2008 3:07 PM on j-body.org
How about intelligent design vs. the theory of evolution?
If that doesn't beg an argument about religion I don't know what does.
It also begs a huge kick in the nuts if you believe ID is the way of the world.

Personally I only get into religion arguments if it is with someone that I know can strongly defend their position, but also accept the fact that not everyone believes like they do. Its no fun, nor is anything learned when argue with someone who is totally bullheaded, or someone who has blind faith without reason.

Funnily enough I gave my grand ma(huge christian warrior) a dvd copy of Zeitgeist over the weekend and told her to call me when she got done watching it - which she said she'd do sunday after church lol. I still have yet to hear back from her, and kind of doubt that I will because that is the type of person she is. Unwilling to accept doubt or believe in anyway that she could be wrong about such a thing.






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