Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws - Politics and War Forum

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Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Thursday, July 08, 2010 10:58 PM on j-body.org
Thieves could go free while victim faces jail time:

WHEAT RIDGE, Colo. - Admitted thieves are going free, while an elderly Wheat Ridge man is facing the possibility of spending the rest of his life behind bars, all, he says, for trying to defend his property and his life.

http://www.kdvr.com/news/kdvr-theives-free-victim-arrested-txt,0,231586.story

I know in my state of Florida, this man would be a hero.





How many steps to heaven, Doc?
...Ah, metaphysics.

Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Friday, July 09, 2010 3:57 AM on j-body.org
although i agree he should get a reward because he shot at them as they were driving away his life will be considerd not in danger and he will get nailed for shooting at them. sad but true. but i dont understand how someone could admit to stealing the trailor and they not throw the guy in jail. and being illegal his ass should be deported.


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Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Friday, July 09, 2010 4:13 AM on j-body.org
Only in America do criminals have more rights than victims.








Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Friday, July 09, 2010 8:46 PM on j-body.org
Spike J wrote:

Only in America do criminals have more rights than victims.




Ding Ding Ding The justice system there needs a major re haul as i'm sure it does everywhere else the law is corrupt and stupid .


This man provided he were younger should have shot them and actually hit them and kill them and just bury them in the backyard and don't call the cops and problem solved and if anyone else does it just make an example out of them .


Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved Acts 16:31

Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.
" Mark Twain "
Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Saturday, July 10, 2010 8:02 AM on j-body.org
Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't some states actually have laws that allow you to defend your property with deadly force if necessary?





Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Saturday, July 10, 2010 1:59 PM on j-body.org
most states do. probalby his very own state where this happend. the problem is when someone is driving away, they are no threat to you or your family so shooting them as they are driving away is a big no no. i mean if they were attacking him go ahead and shoot them, but this wasn't the case.


http://www.flickr.com/photos/sndsgood/ https://www.facebook.com/#!/Square1Photography
Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Saturday, July 10, 2010 5:03 PM on j-body.org
What I meant by that is that there are states where you are allowed to defend your property (not just land, but anything you own) against theft with whatever force necessary. Even if someone is not directly threatening you, but is trying to make off with your stuff, I believe some states still allow you to defend it by shooting if necessary. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure this is the case in some areas.





Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Sunday, July 11, 2010 11:24 AM on j-body.org
John H wrote:

Spike J wrote:

Only in America do criminals have more rights than victims.




Ding Ding Ding The justice system there needs a major re haul as i'm sure it does everywhere else the law is corrupt and stupid .


This man provided he were younger should have shot them and actually hit them and kill them and just bury them in the backyard and don't call the cops and problem solved and if anyone else does it just make an example out of them .

Only in Canada do residents think they know more about America then Americans.

Oh, and Spike J: jeezus man, cheer up! Y'all are completely mistaken. You think it's bad here, try any number of third-world backwaters where criminal force IS the law. Love your country, don't piss on it...it's still the best place on Earth!





Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Sunday, July 11, 2010 11:53 AM on j-body.org
Oh, and I forgot to mention: a private citizen who shoots thieves in the back becomes a criminal due to his poor decision making ability under duress. His actions reflect poorly on all gun owners, and also give excellent ammunition to the anti-gun lobby. Shame on him for becoming a murderous fool when the situation gets hairy. Betraying and embarrassing the right to keep and bear arms by such actions is...unforgivable.






Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Sunday, July 11, 2010 12:24 PM on j-body.org
Take Back the Republican Party wrote:

John H wrote:

Spike J wrote:

Only in America do criminals have more rights than victims.




Ding Ding Ding The justice system there needs a major re haul as i'm sure it does everywhere else the law is corrupt and stupid .


This man provided he were younger should have shot them and actually hit them and kill them and just bury them in the backyard and don't call the cops and problem solved and if anyone else does it just make an example out of them .

Only in Canada do residents think they know more about America then Americans.

Oh, and Spike J: jeezus man, cheer up! Y'all are completely mistaken. You think it's bad here, try any number of third-world backwaters where criminal force IS the law. Love your country, don't piss on it...it's still the best place on Earth!




I never said i knew i knew more about america then americans so take your anti-canada propaganda elsewhere .


Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved Acts 16:31

Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.
" Mark Twain "
Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Sunday, July 11, 2010 12:45 PM on j-body.org
John H wrote:

Take Back the Republican Party wrote:

John H wrote:

Spike J wrote:

Only in America do criminals have more rights than victims.




Ding Ding Ding The justice system there needs a major re haul as i'm sure it does everywhere else the law is corrupt and stupid .


This man provided he were younger should have shot them and actually hit them and kill them and just bury them in the backyard and don't call the cops and problem solved and if anyone else does it just make an example out of them .

Only in Canada do residents think they know more about America then Americans.

Oh, and Spike J: jeezus man, cheer up! Y'all are completely mistaken. You think it's bad here, try any number of third-world backwaters where criminal force IS the law. Love your country, don't piss on it...it's still the best place on Earth!




I never said i knew i knew more about america then americans so take your anti-canada propaganda elsewhere .

Wrong. Anti-Canada it ain't. Anti-Canadians who talk out their asses on a subject thay are unqualfied to comment on...now that's more like it. I have many Canadian friends. I rather enjoy their laid-back attitude; nay, I actually envy them for it. However, they are not your type. Good thing too, else they'd not be my friends.







Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Sunday, July 11, 2010 4:07 PM on j-body.org
Take Back the Republican Party wrote:

John H wrote:

Take Back the Republican Party wrote:

John H wrote:

Spike J wrote:

Only in America do criminals have more rights than victims.




Ding Ding Ding The justice system there needs a major re haul as i'm sure it does everywhere else the law is corrupt and stupid .


This man provided he were younger should have shot them and actually hit them and kill them and just bury them in the backyard and don't call the cops and problem solved and if anyone else does it just make an example out of them .

Only in Canada do residents think they know more about America then Americans.

Oh, and Spike J: jeezus man, cheer up! Y'all are completely mistaken. You think it's bad here, try any number of third-world backwaters where criminal force IS the law. Love your country, don't piss on it...it's still the best place on Earth!




I never said i knew i knew more about america then americans so take your anti-canada propaganda elsewhere .

Wrong. Anti-Canada it ain't. Anti-Canadians who talk out their asses on a subject thay are unqualfied to comment on...now that's more like it. I have many Canadian friends. I rather enjoy their laid-back attitude; nay, I actually envy them for it. However, they are not your type. Good thing too, else they'd not be my friends.



Sure i might not be qualified but i got my opinions now don't i and my attitude is up to par with everyone else on here ok .


Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved Acts 16:31

Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.
" Mark Twain "
Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Sunday, July 11, 2010 8:48 PM on j-body.org
Take Back the Republican Party wrote:

Oh, and I forgot to mention: a private citizen who shoots thieves in the back becomes a criminal due to his poor decision making ability under duress. His actions reflect poorly on all gun owners, and also give excellent ammunition to the anti-gun lobby. Shame on him for becoming a murderous fool when the situation gets hairy. Betraying and embarrassing the right to keep and bear arms by such actions is...unforgivable.


For once I actually tend to agree with you. If they were actively breaking into his house and he caught them, it would be a different story and I'd be all for shooting their asses. However they were driving away and not imposing any 'life threatening' force.

He should have gotten a license plate number (if possible) before they sped away and called the cops. He knows the number on the trailer so it would be easier to catch them.



Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Monday, July 12, 2010 6:04 AM on j-body.org
ThatGuy85 wrote:

Take Back the Republican Party wrote:

Oh, and I forgot to mention: a private citizen who shoots thieves in the back becomes a criminal due to his poor decision making ability under duress. His actions reflect poorly on all gun owners, and also give excellent ammunition to the anti-gun lobby. Shame on him for becoming a murderous fool when the situation gets hairy. Betraying and embarrassing the right to keep and bear arms by such actions is...unforgivable.


For once I actually tend to agree with you. If they were actively breaking into his house and he caught them, it would be a different story and I'd be all for shooting their asses. However they were driving away and not imposing any 'life threatening' force.

He should have gotten a license plate number (if possible) before they sped away and called the cops. He knows the number on the trailer so it would be easier to catch them.

Mmm, I daresay it's been more than once, but this may just be the first time you've developed the nads to man up and go against the grain. Congratulations on that, and I mean that sincerely. It takes courage and maturity to not bow under to peer pressure.

You are correct. He had no business threatening the life of anyone, no matter if they are mass murderers, much less illegals (a fact which he, of course, had zero knowledge of at the time he decided he had the right to deliver lethal lead into their bodies). We cannot admire, or be inspired, by such "wild west" style gun use. Such behavior is beneath us as a civilized nation: it is this very behavior we fight wars to prevent. Were it in the actual domicile, where his safety was indeed threatened, then I say they die, and no one cries. That is the letter of the law in this nation: that the home itself is the castle.






Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Tuesday, July 13, 2010 2:31 PM on j-body.org
stop trollin grandpa



Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Tuesday, July 13, 2010 4:22 PM on j-body.org
Well, no, not a Grandpa yet. At 48, my kids are still too young to have given me grandchildren!

But if you have nothing left to play but that "old" card, then thank you for again demonstrating how much you suck at this.





Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Thursday, July 15, 2010 8:49 PM on j-body.org
Spike J wrote:

Only in America do criminals have more rights than victims.



try the UK. There is a guy serving 25 years for shooting another guy that broke into his house and threatened his family (yes the lowlife was armed with a handgun, illegal to posses BTW).



Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Monday, July 19, 2010 6:15 PM on j-body.org
One of my justifications of deadly force is to prevent the severe bodily harm of a individual, it could be argued if a suspect is fleeing he will most likely do it again to someone else.

Case in point. I come home, some druggie is jumping off my wife and i blow his head off (from behind). by how WI law is written, it would be Murder one.

I don't think it should be.

I could have stopped him from doing it to some one else.

But oh well. I rather be judged by twelve then carried by six.



"An appeal to arms and the God of hosts is all that is left us. But we shall not fight our battle alone. There is a just God that presides over the destinies of nations. The battle sir, is not of the strong alone. Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it almighty God. I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death."

Speech at the Second Virginia Convention at St. John's Church in Richmond, Virginia (23 March 1775) Patrick Henry


Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Tuesday, July 20, 2010 1:18 PM on j-body.org
R.W.E. of the J.B.O. wrote:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't some states actually have laws that allow you to defend your property with deadly force if necessary?
There must be limitations to "castle" laws like Texas has. For instance, shooting someone for trampling your garden might be a bit extreme, you're probably better off without your garden gnome, and those kids in your trailer next door with hands full of candy bars probably don't deserve to be shot in the back once you have them under control...
INFIDEL wrote:

One of my justifications of deadly force is to prevent the severe bodily harm of a individual, it could be argued if a suspect is fleeing he will most likely do it again to someone else.
Speculation alone should not be justification. Now, if he had a shopping list of victims, with names yet to be crossed off, I believe that is more than speculation; and most likely, so would a jury of his peers...

Call me a bleeding heart if you want, but I think Jason and Bill make the most sense here.




fortune cookie say: better a delay than a disaster
Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Tuesday, July 20, 2010 4:30 PM on j-body.org
OHV notec wrote:

R.W.E. of the J.B.O. wrote:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't some states actually have laws that allow you to defend your property with deadly force if necessary?
There must be limitations to "castle" laws like Texas has. For instance, shooting someone for trampling your garden might be a bit extreme, you're probably better off without your garden gnome, and those kids in your trailer next door with hands full of candy bars probably don't deserve to be shot in the back once you have them under control...
Yes, I'm sure there are limitations. However, the first I remember hearing about them was watching some TV show (might have been Most Dangerous Jobs or something. I don't remember), but they were talking to a repo man in Texas. He had bullet proof glass installed in his truck, and set the truck up to have all the lift controls in the cab, because if he could not get someone's car on public property, it was dangerous to try to pick it up in their driveway, due to Texas laws which allowed a property owner to shoot someone (including a repo man who is merely taking back something owned by the bank which hired him) for being on their property taking something.






Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Tuesday, July 20, 2010 11:30 PM on j-body.org
The argument that someone running away isn't a threat is solid enough I suppose... save for one thing. How do you know this individual won't attempt to return later and get the jump on you? It is speculative but not implausible. Street trash do tend to have a sort of "no one messes with me and gets away with it" attitude. To top that off, dead scumbags make no one else their victim and this saves a ton vs incarceration costs.

Still, I can see both sides and I probably have to say you shouldn't attempt to kill someone fleeing. I think at most, you should be allowed to attempt non-lethal injury to them so they cannot flee and then call the police. Now if you in good faith attempted a leg shot and it doesn't go well - as long as there is no evidence to the contrary - and things go a bit worse, well so be it. In that case, I think a person should not be charged. If the killing was intentional and verifiably not necessary, then a murder charge is appropriate IMO.






Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Wednesday, July 21, 2010 6:53 AM on j-body.org
I am entertained by the concepts of vigilantism espoused in this thread. In particular, how civilized people can promote empowering armed private citizens to become "judge, jury, and executioner" to a fleeing suspect on the grounds that he MAY be a baddie now and/or in the future...wow. This mindset just blows MY mind. Even policemen and soldiers aren't allowed to kill or maim indiscriminately. The implications of this mindset are amazingly irrational at best, murderously vindictive at worst.






Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Wednesday, July 21, 2010 9:53 AM on j-body.org
All violent criminals suffer from the same illness: Acute lead deficiency.


“Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet you invented. Oh, oh, the irony!” -Jon Stewart
Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Wednesday, July 21, 2010 10:55 AM on j-body.org
Defender of My Waterpark wrote:

All violent criminals suffer from the same illness: Acute lead deficiency.

especially in the frontal lobe. about a 9x9x20mm tubular implant would work fine, must be injected at high velocity though



Re: Why America needs more Stand your Ground/Castle Laws
Wednesday, July 21, 2010 2:03 PM on j-body.org
To repeat:
http://www.timesunion.com/AspStories/story.asp?storyID=952628
DO NOT GIVE CHASE




fortune cookie say: better a delay than a disaster
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