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Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 11:23 AM on j-body.org
OHV notec wrote:

I drive a silver car wrote:

Again I can see it both ways. Personally the D bag that is pushing to have it there should have enough common sense not to put it there and not be such an insensitive prick hole that gets raped in the face by retarded gay elephant.
You clearly didn't watch the video posted above you there^^^


No I didn't and won't be able to for a while. Depending on what is stated my opinion still stands, if it sheds new light on something other than what I know/read/heard I will state my revised/back my original opinion.





Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 12:28 PM on j-body.org
It's just an Olbermann monologue full of condemnation of religious intolerance. Just like he stepped up and condemned the ACLU in the past when they slam any Christian displays of religion, such as a private college putting up crosses in it's rooms, or a church being forced to remove a manger from it's front lawn because it offended a few people.

Oh, wait a minute. I don't remember him defending religion in those cases. Does anyone else?







Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 12:39 PM on j-body.org
If that is the case I won't waste my time and my 1st opinion still stands.




Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 12:50 PM on j-body.org
It also talks about how the building won't even be within eyesight of the WTC (much less on the WTC footprint that has "been under landmark legislation for years"), that it's not actually a "mosque", and that there has been a similar facility right across from the WTC even before the WTC was built. Basically, pointing out all the that the "alternative media" has been feeding the masses (cue Bill with "handlers").

Much of the video is typical Olbermann emotional pandering, but hey, even Beck has had a couple decent points, so you shouldn't dismiss it just because it's Olbermann. Quik is just inserting a strawman into this so he can avoid commenting on the "data"




fortune cookie say: better a delay than a disaster
Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 1:03 PM on j-body.org
I would have to see more then one video saying this isn't going to be a mosque. More than 5 credible news sources that I have read keep calling this a mosque. This video (still haven't watched it) would be the first saying otherwise. Even if there was a Mosque on the property 100 years before this happened. I would still personally consider it disgraceful to erect a new one one or within close vicinity to the WTC.




Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 1:43 PM on j-body.org
I drive a silver car wrote:

I would have to see more then one video saying this isn't going to be a mosque. More than 5 credible news sources that I have read keep calling this a mosque. This video (still haven't watched it) would be the first saying otherwise. Even if there was a Mosque on the property 100 years before this happened. I would still personally consider it disgraceful to erect a new one one or within close vicinity to the WTC.
Note that I put mosque in quotes. This will have a "prayer center" included, but also all kinds of community center stuff as well. Basically, he's saying it's not the traditional form.
But, as far as I'm conserned, it is a mosque. Will it have a minaret and crescent? No idea...
The one across from the WTC is still there; this is a new one, further away. His point is that it's ridiculous for everyone to be throwing a fuss over this one, when there is one even closer already.




fortune cookie say: better a delay than a disaster
Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 2:27 PM on j-body.org
That was there before anything every happened so it shouldn't be an issue. As I stated before I can see it go either way. I think that is the last "New Addition" of "Mosques" that are needs to see at this time. Me being the person in charge of deciding the location should have enough common sense that it is simply a bad idea. Me being the one to choosing the site has every right to build it there anyway.

Again either way but IMO it should never have gotten to the drawing board at that location despite there being one closer and before the WTC. Common sense and basic empathy wouldn't allow that to happen.




Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 2:33 PM on j-body.org
$$$$$$. <----- follow it


“Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet you invented. Oh, oh, the irony!” -Jon Stewart
Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 2:48 PM on j-body.org
I drive a silver car wrote:

That was there before anything every happened so it shouldn't be an issue. As I stated before I can see it go either way. I think that is the last "New Addition" of "Mosques" that are needs to see at this time. Me being the person in charge of deciding the location should have enough common sense that it is simply a bad idea. Me being the one to choosing the site has every right to build it there anyway.

Again either way but IMO it should never have gotten to the drawing board at that location despite there being one closer and before the WTC. Common sense and basic empathy wouldn't allow that to happen.
That would be your version of "common sense", not a universal one. What if this was a Christian/Jewish/Buddhist/Scientologist facility? Not all Muslims support terrorist attacks; does that mean we should prevent those who don't from practicing their religion? Hundreds of non-terrorist Muslims died in the 9/11 attacks, and there were Muslims responding in FDNY and NYPD. There are hundreds of thousands of Muslims in the Tri-state area, and they expect thousands to show up every week during Friday prayer services. Do you damn the many for the actions of the few? Can you support that position in this case and criticize it when it comes to gun control?




fortune cookie say: better a delay than a disaster
Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 2:57 PM on j-body.org
What he said about this subject:
R.W.E. of the J.B.O. wrote:

Quite frankly, I've had it with this kind of PC crap.

What he meant:
"I'd prefer to express my hatred about religious groups as I see fit, openly and without criticism."





Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 3:37 PM on j-body.org
OHV notec wrote:

Quik is just inserting a strawman into this so he can avoid commenting on the "data"
Actually, I'm simply pointing out Olbermann's hypocrisy, and attachment to anything on the left.

Take Back the Republican Party wrote:

What he meant:
"I'd prefer to express my hatred about religious groups as I see fit, openly and without criticism."
LOL. You've got so little to offer any discussion, that you've focussed your attention on feeble personal jabs at me trying to put words in my mouth. Way to go, dumbass.







Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 3:57 PM on j-body.org
R.W.E. of the J.B.O. wrote:

OHV notec wrote:

Quik is just inserting a strawman into this so he can avoid commenting on the "data"
Actually, I'm simply pointing out Olbermann's hypocrisy, and attachment to anything on the left.
Exactly. You ream Bill for attacking this source instead of the content; where's the hypocrisy now?




fortune cookie say: better a delay than a disaster
Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 4:26 PM on j-body.org
Are you really getting that clouded, notec, or are you just being facetious? I am used to you being a little more realistic than that.

While Olbermann provided some facts in his rant, it was mostly a 15 minute propaganda video.







Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 5:07 PM on j-body.org
R.W.E. of the J.B.O. wrote:

Are you really getting that clouded, notec, or are you just being facetious? I am used to you being a little more realistic than that.

While Olbermann provided some facts in his rant, it was mostly a 15 minute propaganda video.
My point is that you completely skipped the facts (some of which went against what you said earlier in the thread, and I've found more since) and went straight to screaming "BIASED!!!"
This is exactly what you've always given Bill crap for doing (I would not have trouble finding links to support this if you deny it )




fortune cookie say: better a delay than a disaster
Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 6:21 PM on j-body.org
There were no facts that had anything to do with what I said. There are other mosques in NYC, and there are churches near ground zero. What does that have to do with having a new mosque built 2 blocks away? On that note, he makes the point that it's "actually more like 4 blocks from the 9/11 memorial site", which means what? 45 Park Place is 2 blocks from the WTC sight. By picking the memorial sight he is simply using semantics to belittle it. You can't see it from ground zero. So what? Of all the places they could have built it, why do they need to be 600 feet from the location of the biggest muslim terrorist attack on US soil? The property sold for "spare change" because no one wanted it? How about the fact that the preservation community and the Manhattan Community Board have been petitioning the Landmark Commission since 1989 to designate this building a landmark? For 20 years the Landmark Commission has refused to hold the hearings regarding this, but suddenly two months ago they have a quick hearing, and deny the petition, when most of the surrounding buildings have already been granted landmark status.

Slightly off this part of the discussion, but relevant to one of my original points: if you want to find out more about this, look into the suit the ACLJ has filed against the ruling of the Landmark Commission. If you read the court petition, you'll see where the Landmark Commission has clearly granted landmark status to many other buildings that could be paralleled to the building in question, right down to a building on Broadway that is of the same type, and it was granted because the Landmark Commission noted that it was one of only a few of that type of building left. Now suddenly they deny this building, after refusing to hold hearings for 20 years? I want to see the money trail on this one.






Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 6:22 PM on j-body.org
R.W.E. of the J.B.O. wrote:

I have a problem with this building being built where it is for the following reasons:

1) The Imam who is heading it is a radical, who has made many anti-American statements.

2) The location has been under landmark legislation for years, and no one has been allowed to do anything. Suddenly all red tape is cut for this guy? Isn't anyone asking questions as to who was paid off for this?

3) Being right near ground zero is not breaking down barriers, it's pouring salt in the wounds of everyone who lost a friend or relative in the attacks.

There are plenty of other locations where they could build a mosque, and there are already plenty of mosques around. They don't need to build it there. This is not about racial or religious intolerance, it's about insensitivity, and about what seems to be some level of impropriety regarding how this was made possible.


An example of you not thinking for yourself. You sound like Newt Gingrich / Sarah Palin.
All you need is to give us a comparison that this is equivalent of a Nazi compound in front of a Jewish temple in the states, like Newt said. Apparently Nazi is now a religion.

R.W.E. of the J.B.O. wrote:

It's just an Olbermann monologue full of condemnation of religious intolerance. Just like he stepped up and condemned the ACLU in the past when they slam any Christian displays of religion, such as a private college putting up crosses in it's rooms, or a church being forced to remove a manger from it's front lawn because it offended a few people.

Oh, wait a minute. I don't remember him defending religion in those cases. Does anyone else?


Since he has a MSNBC icon on the lower left of the screen, I can see why you would dismiss what he had to say.
The real question is is the man lying?

Defender of My Waterpark wrote:

$$$$$$.

Especially when it comes to the media, hyping this up and exaggerating the controversy.


THE POLITICALLY INCORRECT ONE.

Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 6:48 PM on j-body.org
Quote:

Defender of My Waterpark
Quote
Reply


$$$$$$. <----- follow it





Quote me accurately if you're bent on doing it.

.


“Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet you invented. Oh, oh, the irony!” -Jon Stewart
Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 6:49 PM on j-body.org
Mr.Goodwrench-G.T. wrote:

Since he has a MSNBC icon on the lower left of the screen, I can see why you would dismiss what he had to say.
The real question is is the man lying?
LOL. I'll be sure to keep this quote in my favorites for the next time you brush off a link, video, or quote from Fox.

I've already addressed Olbermann's rant broken down by his facts, but I'll say this: I disagree with Olbermann because of what he says, not because of the network he's on. However, when you break down what he says, and the level of propaganda in it, he just blends right in with the rest of the network.







Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 8:14 PM on j-body.org
R.W.E. of the J.B.O. wrote:

Mr.Goodwrench-G.T. wrote:

Since he has a MSNBC icon on the lower left of the screen, I can see why you would dismiss what he had to say.
The real question is is the man lying?
LOL. I'll be sure to keep this quote in my favorites for the next time you brush off a link, video, or quote from Fox.

Please do so, if FOX said something correct, I will proudly admitted. I've heard something on Jay Leno when Bill O'Riley was on and I said "he is correct." Hell, even Glen Beck said something that was posted here on JBO and I even wrote, I was with him on it.
Unlike you, I am not square. If one of these "Modern Liberal" sites talks about the White House being white in color or the world is round, you'll be the first to go against it.. So save your bull shit.
Also don't confuse your so called:"facts' with rants and/or opinions.

R.W.E. of the J.B.O. wrote:


Take Back the Republican Party wrote:

What he meant:
"I'd prefer to express my hatred about religious groups as I see fit, openly and without criticism."
LOL. You've got so little to offer any discussion, that you've focussed your attention on feeble personal jabs at me trying to put words in my mouth. Way to go, dumbass.

Hypocrisy masterfully done.

Defender of My Waterpark wrote:

Defender of My Waterpark
Quote
Reply
Quote me blah-blah ...
$$$$$$.




THE POLITICALLY INCORRECT ONE.

Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Tuesday, August 17, 2010 8:20 PM on j-body.org
OHV notec wrote:

R.W.E. of the J.B.O. wrote:

OHV notec wrote:

Quik is just inserting a strawman into this so he can avoid commenting on the "data"
Actually, I'm simply pointing out Olbermann's hypocrisy, and attachment to anything on the left.
Exactly. You ream Bill for attacking this source instead of the content; where's the hypocrisy now?



He is doing the very anti hojie Christian thing.
Eye for a Eye.

Calling one persion a hyporcrit when he is doing it as a EXAMPLE....... you blind?

And yes bill, goodwrence and all you others, I am Man enough to say it,

I hate the hojies, I FU-CKING REMEMBER 9/11, YOU DON'T.

OR the Armenian's.......ya, you just Googled it...Talk to Karo about it.

What the hojies did to them in the first world War pails what happened to the Jews during the second.






"An appeal to arms and the God of hosts is all that is left us. But we shall not fight our battle alone. There is a just God that presides over the destinies of nations. The battle sir, is not of the strong alone. Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it almighty God. I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death."

Speech at the Second Virginia Convention at St. John's Church in Richmond, Virginia (23 March 1775) Patrick Henry


Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Wednesday, August 18, 2010 5:02 AM on j-body.org
I can't hate an entire religion for the sins of some of its adherents. My Christian upbringing won't allow me to be that brutal or savage. My intellectual upbringing won't allow me to be that stupid.







Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Wednesday, August 18, 2010 6:46 AM on j-body.org
OHV notec wrote:

I drive a silver car wrote:

That was there before anything every happened so it shouldn't be an issue. As I stated before I can see it go either way. I think that is the last "New Addition" of "Mosques" that are needs to see at this time. Me being the person in charge of deciding the location should have enough common sense that it is simply a bad idea. Me being the one to choosing the site has every right to build it there anyway.

Again either way but IMO it should never have gotten to the drawing board at that location despite there being one closer and before the WTC. Common sense and basic empathy wouldn't allow that to happen.
That would be your version of "common sense", not a universal one.


Don't put words in my mouth, your response should have stopped here. ^

Exactly if I was him I wouldn't push for something that controversial out of respect. I have no comment made to any other religion because this was the work of Muslim extremists. I understand that there are plenty that died that had nothing to do with the terrorists nor did I right them all of as being the same. I simply said I think it something that out of respect shouldn't even make it to the drawing boards at that location (again my personal opinion). I've also stated over and over that they have every right to build there, my point is that I would have hoped that it was realized that simply wouldn't be a tasteful choice.




Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Wednesday, August 18, 2010 7:41 AM on j-body.org
I drive a silver car wrote:

OHV notec wrote:

I drive a silver car wrote:

That was there before anything every happened so it shouldn't be an issue. As I stated before I can see it go either way. I think that is the last "New Addition" of "Mosques" that are needs to see at this time. Me being the person in charge of deciding the location should have enough common sense that it is simply a bad idea. Me being the one to choosing the site has every right to build it there anyway.

Again either way but IMO it should never have gotten to the drawing board at that location despite there being one closer and before the WTC. Common sense and basic empathy wouldn't allow that to happen.
That would be your version of "common sense", not a universal one.


Don't put words in my mouth, your response should have stopped here. ^

Exactly if I was him I wouldn't push for something that controversial out of respect. I have no comment made to any other religion because this was the work of Muslim extremists. I understand that there are plenty that died that had nothing to do with the terrorists nor did I right them all of as being the same. I simply said I think it something that out of respect shouldn't even make it to the drawing boards at that location (again my personal opinion). I've also stated over and over that they have every right to build there, my point is that I would have hoped that it was realized that simply wouldn't be a tasteful choice.

"Common sense" is exactly that...a majority or common view. Same with "basic empathy". This inherently infers a more tolerant perspective, so yes...I also disagree with the use of these terms as a rationale for denying a religious structure...of ANY faith.

This structure in that location may offend you, and that's fine. That still doesn't make your discomfort "common sense" or "basic empathy". Quite frankly, I find your discomfort to be framed in a LACK of either aspect.






Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Wednesday, August 18, 2010 9:40 AM on j-body.org
Take Back the Republican Party wrote:

I drive a silver car wrote:

OHV notec wrote:

I drive a silver car wrote:

That was there before anything every happened so it shouldn't be an issue. As I stated before I can see it go either way. I think that is the last "New Addition" of "Mosques" that are needs to see at this time. Me being the person in charge of deciding the location should have enough common sense that it is simply a bad idea. Me being the one to choosing the site has every right to build it there anyway.

Again either way but IMO it should never have gotten to the drawing board at that location despite there being one closer and before the WTC. Common sense and basic empathy wouldn't allow that to happen.
That would be your version of "common sense", not a universal one.


Don't put words in my mouth, your response should have stopped here. ^

Exactly if I was him I wouldn't push for something that controversial out of respect. I have no comment made to any other religion because this was the work of Muslim extremists. I understand that there are plenty that died that had nothing to do with the terrorists nor did I right them all of as being the same. I simply said I think it something that out of respect shouldn't even make it to the drawing boards at that location (again my personal opinion). I've also stated over and over that they have every right to build there, my point is that I would have hoped that it was realized that simply wouldn't be a tasteful choice.

"Common sense" is exactly that...a majority or common view. Same with "basic empathy". This inherently infers a more tolerant perspective, so yes...I also disagree with the use of these terms as a rationale for denying a religious structure...of ANY faith.

This structure in that location may offend you, and that's fine. That still doesn't make your discomfort "common sense" or "basic empathy". Quite frankly, I find your discomfort to be framed in a LACK of either aspect.


Does anyone in this thread read? Again I said that is "MY" opinion. That should stop there, never do I compare "MY" opinion to those making the decision. I said IN MY OPINION this never should have gotten this far period. However it did, this would clearly meant that MY opinion and MY (idea) of common sense and MY (thought) of empathy isn't that of the involved.

Second, I clearly stated that I feel this could easily go either way. They have every right to build a mosque there and no one should be able to stop them. I said that I could understand why many would be upset with this choice. I then gave my own personal opinion which is that I can see it go either way however if I was the one making that choice it would never have made it this far. That decision would have no bases on whats right or wrong, my personal feelings or anything. I wouldn't build something somewhere that is going to be the center for huge controversy. By doing so I could potentially be placing those that would attend or visit the "center" in harms way and it could potentially lead do endangerment of others. This to ME would be common sense on that aspect alone not to have this as an option.




Re: Obama defends construction of mosque near Ground Zero site in NY.
Wednesday, August 18, 2010 11:13 AM on j-body.org
Whether you find my "discomfort" a lack of either aspect.

It appears most people feel the same way I do

A CNN/Opinion Research poll released last week found that nearly 70 percent of Americans opposed the mosque plan, while 29 percent approved.

In a new question, the latest poll found that many New Yorkers believe the project is protected by the Constitution, even if they oppose the plan.

Nearly two-thirds of voters, 64 percent, say the developers have a constitutional right to build the mosque. Twenty-eight percent say they do not.




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