I fill up on fuel on my way out to the autox. I found a 10psi difference between the front and rear help make the difference too.
last autox 44 front, 35 rear. I'm going to drop the rear down to 32 next time to see if it helps anymore.
Rear traction is great at that setting.
also if the car is way too tail happy, try reguaging your braking points. The J-body loves to lose traction during if your to heavy on the brake and turning at the same time. <br>
-Chris
Zach wrote:Sean, just put the shims on there man. Do you know anybody thats willing to shell out the money to protest you on the issue? Even if they did, F$#@ them, its not like adding a little bit of camber to the rear gave you a huge competitive advantage over them (most likely they would just be pissed because they lost to a cavalier).
Don't get rid of the cavalier even though the MR-2 is probably as much fun.
Sean, did you run the MR-2 or the cavalier at Toledo this past year?
Yes, they'd be pissed they lost to a Cav...which would lead them to believe something is obviously illegal. People WILL protest at the larger events like Pro's and Tours that I plan on attending in '05. When it could affect their sponsorships or money they could be winning, they will protest. People have protested the spare wheel cover out of a car...as it's supposed to stay in the car since it is carpet...and there is no removing of carpet. It gets picky, believe me.
Having the proper rear camber is important, esp. rear toe. I will not race the Crapalier without a proper alignment. "They" have their rear camber set, I want to be able to do it to mine. Unless I've been reading the rules wrong the whole time, it's just another retarted STS rule since everyone else is allowed to change their rear camber aside from those who have a solid rear and need shims to get the settings they want. I shall be writing a letter to the SEB on the subject.
That MR-2 isn't mine. I was the co-driver. I've been done with that car since returning to STS as I'm having success. I want to continue down that road but I need to do it legally. The shims are a big sticking point right now. I'll have to remove them if they are indeed illegal, but then I'm at the whim of whatever settings it goes back too.
The Toledo CenDiv this year, I ran neither the Crapalier or the MR-2. I ran Billy Brooks' RS in STS (with brand new falken, which equals understeer.....i HATE understeer.) The only time this year in STS where I didn't earn a trophy...coincidentally, the only time I didn't run the Crapalier. I need to co-drive his car again since the Falkens are broken in, but doesn't look like that will happen this year.
If the Crapalier is unable to go in '05, I'm going to have to do some mad scrambling for a real ride. I'll probably will continue to build up the Cav in case the rules change or for a JBody Challange.....
IamRascal wrote:I fill up on fuel on my way out to the autox.
........
also if the car is way too tail happy, try reguaging your braking points. The J-body loves to lose traction during if your to heavy on the brake and turning at the same time.
Fuel + fillup = at least 100+lbs you don't need. You've made yourself slower. You've made f/r weight transfer more of an issue too. I run no-where near a full tank.
That's called trailbraking Rascal.
It'll help those without a rear bar to rotate. Don't need to apply the brake hard either. I was drifting yesterday when I did it in a sweeper. Pretty damn fun sometimes.
<br>
Lightweight honDuhs can kiss my fat Crapalier a$$
A new autoX ride for '08.....
I've tried it both ways with fuel and without fuel and the "added weight" helps A LOT more traction-wise than it hinders acceleratio and timing-wise. The added weight doesn't make the car really any slower. My times are considerable faster with the added weight simply from being able to push the car harder before I would have to worry about losing traction. Have you tried it or are you just dead set against the added weight? Weight is not always an enemy. Weight in the wrong places is the enemy.
i tell you what i run with a 1/4th tank but the first few events i did i had a full tank and the car did not change direction that well but with less fuel it is alot better. AKA less push. and my car pushed like a dump truck. bad bad oh so bad
<br>
see ya!
You don't have a rear sway bar do you novaracer? With bald, corded azenis in the rear along with a sway bar and tie bar I get bad oversteer without some gas in the tank. The oversteer really is only a problem when I'm on asphalt, but when I'm on concrete the car feels perfect. <br>
Sean, I asked about Toledo because a friend of mine in my region ran his MR-2 there this past season and I was wondering if you knew him. Jesse Naughton is his name <br>
Zach,, you ran Gainsville this past weekend? I was looking for you again... I ran SM finished 5th out of 17. top 7 times in SM were stupid close. I coned my last run, would have been good for 2nd
National Champ in AM was there in the crazy shark. he ran a 39.xx,, I ran a 53.0
i ran an event last weekend in Greer SC at the BMW manufacturing plant and i ran a 38.4 and he ran 30.xx.. That thing is crazy fast.
here are the results from Jacksonville
Event #10 Results
i finished 16th raw time out of 101..with hoosiers that have over 55 runs, i lost count ..
here are the results from Greer
SCR event
get some pics up later <br>
AIRPLANE SHANE
Mazda Rev It Up Atlanta Champion '03
#118 H2 98 Honda Civic DX
http://teamlovely.shutterfly.com
89Z24 conv. island cruiser
I forgot to mention that the Grassroots Motorsports SRT4 neon is running SM now. he got a rear sway and some srpings.. <br>
AIRPLANE SHANE
Mazda Rev It Up Atlanta Champion '03
#118 H2 98 Honda Civic DX
http://teamlovely.shutterfly.com
89Z24 conv. island cruiser
I want to drive that civic just one time on R compounds.
Gainesville was fun (and quite close to my house). I didn't have any exhaust on the car except for a header because my exhaust shop couldn't work me on saturday like they said they would.... <br>
Zach wrote:Sean, I asked about Toledo because a friend of mine in my region ran his MR-2 there this past season and I was wondering if you knew him. Jesse Naughton is his name
no that was GS class on rsa's
said thing is i just started autox this year because i wanted to see what all the hype was about? and then i went out foe my first run and was hooked
9 events later here i am waiting for my addco bar to get here and pondering tires for next year
i ran 2 events with mx's and they have tons of grip compared to the rsa's i have been doing better and better each event even got three woods this year
<br>
see ya!
hey guys since vw uses the same type of rear bar i did some searching on their rear sway bars. and they have a bar that gets mounted into the rear axle
and i read that a guy that autox's a rabbit runs that bar and a 28mm bar on the rear at the same time
well check this out.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=576793
post your thoughts. <br>
see ya!
jonnyonwheels wrote:I've tried it both ways with fuel and without fuel and the "added weight" helps A LOT more traction-wise than it hinders acceleratio and timing-wise. The added weight doesn't make the car really any slower. My times are considerable faster with the added weight simply from being able to push the car harder before I would have to worry about losing traction. Have you tried it or are you just dead set against the added weight? Weight is not always an enemy. Weight in the wrong places is the enemy.
Weight is always the enemy when you are running against 2000# Si's. I've tried anything from full to fuel light on and I've run the range of tire pressures. I have plenty of rear traction running what I do. An alignment (hence the shims issue) and proper tire & tire pressures will give you rear traction worlds' better than running around with 100+lbs.
Zach wrote:With bald, corded azenis in the rear along with a sway bar and tie bar I get bad oversteer without some gas in the tank. The oversteer really is only a problem when I'm on asphalt, but when I'm on concrete the car feels perfect.
Zach: If you have problems on a different surfaces, adding weight (fuel) is definately not the answer. You need to experiment with tire pressures. And quit running on corded tires.
Zach wrote:Sean, I asked about Toledo because a friend of mine in my region ran his MR-2 there this past season and I was wondering if you knew him. Jesse Naughton is his name
Nope, name doesn't ring a bell.
<br>
Lightweight honDuhs can kiss my fat Crapalier a$$
A new autoX ride for '08.....
I was fooling with tire pressures at Gainesville on Sunday. 41-43 in the front, 30 in the rear seemed to work for me on asphalt. As far as the corded azenis, I'm hoping they last me till Christmas so I can buy a couple new ones to replace the corded ones with.
What kind of alignment changes could be done in the rear to help besides camber? I wouldn't think you would want to play with rear toe. <br>
Zach wrote:I was fooling with tire pressures at Gainesville on Sunday. 41-43 in the front, 30 in the rear seemed to work for me on asphalt. As far as the corded azenis, I'm hoping they last me till Christmas so I can buy a couple new ones to replace the corded ones with.
What kind of alignment changes could be done in the rear to help besides camber? I wouldn't think you would want to play with rear toe.
You can change camber and toe with the shims I use. Rear toe, which is what I'm most concerned with, makes a dramatic difference depending on settings. You can set that thing up to swing it's rear out on almost every turn or to push like a pig just from rear toe settings.
<br>
Lightweight honDuhs can kiss my fat Crapalier a$$
A new autoX ride for '08.....
Shims confirmed not to be in the factory service manual or TSB.
Crapalier is now retired.
<br>
Lightweight honDuhs can kiss my fat Crapalier a$$
A new autoX ride for '08.....
i dont think that it is in the vw manual either. same difference if you ask me. i will look in the bentely manual today whiule i am over at my dads. but i dont think that you would have a problem. as far as a shim or you could have them heat it up and bent it to the specs you want.
if you retire the car look into the ion redline next year i think they come with a lsd
can you run that in STS
or a used 328i <br>
see ya!
My bentley manual from my '81 scirocco doesn't say that shims are an approved way to correct alignment so I think it's either no one cares that they're doing it, or it's only illegal if you get caught?!
thats what i am saying johnny
and the vw 2 bar setup makes sense to me the more that i think about it.
<br>
see ya!
Dam it, you can retire the crapalier. Thats my idol. <br>
novaracer wrote:i dont think that it is in the vw manual either. same difference if you ask me. i will look in the bentely manual today whiule i am over at my dads. but i dont think that you would have a problem. as far as a shim or you could have them heat it up and bent it to the specs you want.
if you retire the car look into the ion redline next year i think they come with a lsd can you run that in STS
or a used 328i
Bending is also illegal.
The ION will have the same issue as they have a solid rear. If the Cobalt or Ion has factory approved shims for alignment, I might consider it...but doubtful. The Redline will be either in STX or STU. The used BMW is not a great choice for STS due to limited tire size. They do much better with a 245 than a 225.
jonnyonwheels wrote:My bentley manual from my '81 scirocco doesn't say that shims are an approved way to correct alignment so I think it's either no one cares that they're doing it, or it's only illegal if you get caught?!
If they are running mostly at a local/regional level, most people don't or won't care unless it's obviously illegal. Once you start to go to larger, National level events where more is on the line, people will start to inspect the car more and challange it as they become more familiar with it, especially if you start to earn wood.
And it's illegal whether you get caught or not. I prefer to play by the rules.
Zach wrote:Damn it, you can't retire the Crapalier. Thats my idol.
Idol? Thanks.
Maybe you could buy some parts off of it then.
<br>
Lightweight honDuhs can kiss my fat Crapalier a$$
A new autoX ride for '08.....
Just wanted to add:
*&#^!!@^&%^&!@#*)(*!(*@&(@!*&^#!^%_(*&@^&!*)@*!^&#($&@(!(*&@!
<br>
Lightweight honDuhs can kiss my fat Crapalier a$$
A new autoX ride for '08.....
I like to play by the rules also but for testing only on the regional level you could play with the shims to see if it makes the difference you're looking for before really worrying about it.
I think a lot of your grip problems i think are due to the tires. If you're running azenis they are an scca approved tire for the street tire class but are not really a competition tire. A friend of mine just bought a wheel/tire package for his dakota that came with 200 treadware tires. The falken's azenis have a treadware of 200 and the hoosier have a treadware of 40. So just from that you can see how much stickier the hoosiers will be. Even kumho's and yokohama's r-compounds have a treadware of like 50 max! If you could put your car on hoosier a3s04's for one event even in a narrower tire than you have now you will see what I mean. The hoosiers are simply the best dot approved race tire available for autocross. I'm changing up from a 15x7 wheel to a 16x7 next year so I can run an even wider tire than is available to me now, but not going any wider than a 16x7 so that I don't have to buy new wheels if/when I move to prepared class. I think you might be going by the book more than the seat of your pants when it comes to sorting out your suspension.
jonnyonwheels wrote:I like to play by the rules also but for testing only on the regional level you could play with the shims to see if it makes the difference you're looking for before really worrying about it.
Shims make a difference. Already a known factor. I raced 2 years with the stock alignment. <br>
Lightweight honDuhs can kiss my fat Crapalier a$$
A new autoX ride for '08.....
