Getrag full metal shifter (interest?) - Transmission Forum

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Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 1:12 PM
So upon finding out the B&M short throw was finally discontinued for the 00-05 getrag in the Jbody (boo), I started brainstorming ideas on how to fabricate my own for the skwirl.

The skwirl has a B&M but its old and I wouldn't mind something that had less play in it (well, as close to it with cables anyway) so I've come up with a design that would completely replace the stock shifter assembly save for the joints that sit on the bottom of the ball sockets and connect the shifter assembly to the cables (the only parts reused from the factory shifter).

Would there be any interest in a full metal shifter for the getrag? It will have ballbearings at all pivot points for smooth operation and longevity. It'll have a standard thread for a shift knob. There will be no reverse lock-out. I am confident I can squeeze it under the factory center console, but I am not sure about being able to re-use the shift boot.

I was also toying with the idea of making the shifter 'adjustable'. Meaning you can adjust the stick height to your liking... -OR- I was thinking of making the pivot point adjustable so you can move it higher and make the throw super short.

I have tested the theory of how my shifter will work with some scrap I had laying around in work, and I built a functioning prototype out of uh.. legos of all things... but it works.

I realize that having pictures of something tangible is worth way more than a bunch of theories and words so when I come up with something I'll post up a few pictures..

So if anyone is interested please post in this thread. this project is on the backburner right now but if there's overwhelming interest I can move it higher on the priority list. I've already sourced some of the parts I'd need to make it including the ballsockets for the shift cable connections and the ballbearing sizes I'd need.







Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 1:21 PM
Sounds like a good idea PJ. I'll be subscribed even thought I already have a B&M.



Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 1:47 PM
im in. love my ebay shifter, but with me missing 3rd gear racing and losing transmissions, ill take the upgrade!



Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 2:27 PM
I was originally going to reuse the factory shift cable connectors for my shifter but after taking more measurements just now, this will completely replace the stock shifter assembly.

the entire thing.

not a single part from the factory shifter will be reused other than the shift cables.

I'm doing a more extensive drawing now. My hopes are high. going to be making a functional prototype for testing in the skwirl soon.






Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 3:14 PM
I'm game!!! I'd love a tighter smoother throw!



LE61T PTE6262 Powered

Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 3:32 PM
back in 2002/2003 it was done by someone in MI. It was super expensive... something like 3-400$ per shifter... if you look it up, you will see it.. they sold the shifters to mantapart for a while then I'm not sure what happened anymore...

-Karo




Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 4:05 PM
Karo (Car Customs) wrote:

back in 2002/2003 it was done by someone in MI. It was super expensive... something like 3-400$ per shifter... if you look it up, you will see it.. they sold the shifters to mantapart for a while then I'm not sure what happened anymore...

-Karo


I DO remember mantapart listing a full metal shifter on their website, but I never saw pictures of it. and I do remember it being super expensive too.

the bearings are what is going to drive the cost of this shifter up.. I won't be sure on pricing until I fabricate the prototype.





Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 4:18 PM
crude prototype demonstrating mechanism







Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 5:18 PM
interested




R.I.P. Brian Klocke, you will never be forgotten
Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 5:29 PM
You have my attention.


Boost > N/A

180hp in 1989 or 260hp in 2008, you decide. Quad < Ecotec

Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 5:56 PM
Hell yeah I'm listening!

My next one will be this or a TWM for a cobalt.



13.520 @ 98mph! 220whp 234tq

Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 7:17 PM
Karo (Car Customs) wrote:

back in 2002/2003 it was done by someone in MI. It was super expensive... something like 3-400$ per shifter... if you look it up, you will see it.. they sold the shifters to mantapart for a while then I'm not sure what happened anymore...

-Karo


I remember that guy too. White Cav with orange stripes ( I think ). I will look to see if I have a picture of it



Jason
99 Z24 Supercharged
157hp/171tq - NA
190hp/170tq @ 6psi

LG0/LD9 for Life
Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Friday, August 20, 2010 9:17 PM
just by looking at it, its already better than my short throw, the plastic pieces and the pins work but that seems a lot better of an idea...



Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Saturday, August 21, 2010 1:21 AM
worked out some more of the design elements before I left work tonight.

Made a small change to the cage and how it carries the bearings. The alteration I made will keep the cage smaller which is always good.

Going to order the parts I need to fabricate the prototype and work on it over the course of next week.

I still need to design a frame that will carry the cage, be open enough to allow the shifter and sidearm to work properly and maintain rigidity. I think its going to come together after I make the baseplate and get a better idea of what kind of dimensions I have to play with so far as height goes. I'm putting the pivot higher than stock (something even the B&M shifter had to deal with) so the throw should be pretty damn short.. I'm also hoping this has the added benefit of 'hiding' any play in the cables to hopefully make the shifter feel more solid.. of course, I realize that shift effort has to be maintained as well.

I'm going to make the prototype out of welded steel, but I'm going to refine the assembly process as much as possible if I do end up making any duplicates.

Again, pricing is yet to be disclosed because I have no idea on what the final cost of materials will be yet... but if you guys want to start a list in the thread as a FEELER, maybe I can use that to convince myself to do a GP in the future (with jbo permission of course when and if that time does come).




Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Saturday, August 21, 2010 7:10 AM
Interested.



FU Tuning



Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Saturday, August 21, 2010 10:19 AM
If its under the 200-250 range then I'd likely take one in the spring. This damn wiggly shifter is kind of starting to piss me off. And not working with the stock shift boot doesnt confront me, my bracket for the stock one's been broken for months and its been just sitting under the climate controls. If its even cheaper I'll be able to afford it even earlier.


1994 Saturn SL2 Home Coming Edition: backup car
2002 Chevy Cavalier LS Sport Coupe: In a Junk Yard
1995 Mazda Miata R-package Class=STR
Sponsored by: Kronos Performance

WPI Class of '12 Mechanical Engineering
WPI SAE Risk and Sustainability Management Officer
Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Saturday, August 21, 2010 5:57 PM
great idea, man. but ahhh, no isusu love?

i too remember seeing that shifter listed on manatapart. i wanted it for years but never got around to it. now you dont see it listed.






Oldsmobile all motor > Saab/Opel boosted
Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Saturday, August 21, 2010 7:37 PM
Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Saturday, August 21, 2010 7:54 PM
One feature that I just thought of which would be nice would be adjustable centering spring force. It wouldn't add much complexity at all, heck it might even just be a byproduct of how you decide to attach the springs.


1994 Saturn SL2 Home Coming Edition: backup car
2002 Chevy Cavalier LS Sport Coupe: In a Junk Yard
1995 Mazda Miata R-package Class=STR
Sponsored by: Kronos Performance

WPI Class of '12 Mechanical Engineering
WPI SAE Risk and Sustainability Management Officer
Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Saturday, August 21, 2010 10:06 PM
isuzu is a possibility if i were ever to get my hands on a shifter assembly to see if i could adapt my system to the isuzu style setup (i'm willing to bet its very similar).


I'm not sure what the point of a centering spring on the shifter would do.. the shift levers on the transmission have that built into it.






Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Sunday, August 22, 2010 9:21 AM
Oh my bad I didn't realize it was on the tranny.


1994 Saturn SL2 Home Coming Edition: backup car
2002 Chevy Cavalier LS Sport Coupe: In a Junk Yard
1995 Mazda Miata R-package Class=STR
Sponsored by: Kronos Performance

WPI Class of '12 Mechanical Engineering
WPI SAE Risk and Sustainability Management Officer

Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Sunday, August 22, 2010 8:37 PM
Depending on pricing i would be in for one and I dont even have a manual car yet lol.



Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Monday, August 23, 2010 3:01 PM
ordered the bearings, rod ends, drill bits and taps I'm going to need to build the prototype.

I've sourced the other raw materials to scrap laying around the shop in work.


I should have it built and working by the weekend.

I'm attempting to keep the cost as close to the B&M short throw shifter as possible... so hopefully in the neighborhood of $150-$200 depending on the quality and size of the bearings and rod ends I use.

it more likely than not will be made of welded steel, its a material I can work with easily and keep costs to a minimum. Simplicity is the goal here.. I was debating about having machined aluminum parts for 'pretty factor' but for anyone who has seen my "Industrial Strength" ecotec upper motor mount knows that even simplicity can look good and overkill is never a bad thing.









One piece of 1/2" thick angle steel with 5/8" thick gussets welded to the bottom. Direct mount to the block and the frame rail.

This shifter will follow suit in terms of simplicity, function and 'industrial' feel.
I was thinking about making it out of stainless, but that will drive costs up quite a bit and stainless is a bit more difficult to work with.



Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Monday, August 23, 2010 3:27 PM
Well im starting a list even if you wont

1. Vince, Paypal asap.



Re: Getrag full metal shifter (interest?)
Tuesday, August 24, 2010 9:25 AM
z yaaaa wrote:

great idea, man. but ahhh, no isusu love?

i too remember seeing that shifter listed on manatapart. i wanted it for years but never got around to it. now you dont see it listed.


If PJ doesn't make one I could look into it, as long as PJ was ok with it. I don't want to steal his fire or anything.

DaFlyinSkwirl (Pj) v2.0 wrote:

isuzu is a possibility if i were ever to get my hands on a shifter assembly to see if i could adapt my system to the isuzu style setup (i'm willing to bet its very similar).


I'm not sure what the point of a centering spring on the shifter would do.. the shift levers on the transmission have that built into it.


The centering spring in the tranny (at least on my Isuzu) is pretty damn weak, without the aid of another spring at the shifter assembly I would think it would move pretty sluggish.

Looking great PJ, and great idea.



Paying someone to install parts and bragging about it being fast, is like watching someone bang your wife and being proud to raise their kids.
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