Those with Emanage and low imped injectors... - Tuning Forum

Forum Post / Reply
You must log in before you can post or reply to messages.
Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Saturday, November 05, 2005 2:34 PM
I think I know why the Emanage doesn't read the right duty cycle for your cars. It's due to the fact that they're "peak and hold" injectors. This means the injectors recieve a full jolt of current, which then drops to a lower current to hold the injector open once it's open. The Emanage must not be reading the current after it drops down to the "hold" status.

That's my 5 cents.


O noes!

Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Saturday, November 05, 2005 3:35 PM
Hmmm....you might be on to something there Smokey...but...now the question would be what could we do to change this...

but you most def. could be on to something there....



Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Sunday, November 06, 2005 10:50 AM
listening....




Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Sunday, November 06, 2005 12:11 PM
I have been thinking about this but can come up with no way to find a solution to this, I will have to consult with Jamie Smith and Jason Young....



Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Tuesday, November 08, 2005 12:20 PM
Makes sence cuz the E Manage seems to hate my car....

Listening......


- 93 mph in the 1/8 mile
Member of J-Body Of Michigan.

Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Tuesday, November 08, 2005 1:08 PM
Being a complete emanage newb, could someone explain how the emange uses the current of the injectors to calculate the pulse width? Or detail the problem in general you guys are having?




Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Tuesday, November 08, 2005 3:29 PM
My emanage wont read normal injection duty cycle correctly....

And it reads perfectly with a Tech 2...Therefore I cant add any fuel on the additional injection map when the normal cycle wont go up because it multiplys from the normal injection...



Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Tuesday, November 08, 2005 5:30 PM
with the e-manage ultimate you have to run high impedance injectors.
Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Tuesday, November 08, 2005 6:11 PM
This is for the Blue users....

I have been researching this for some time now, and I cannot find a way to correct the injector issue. I have tried resistors to make the emanage think its receiving high impedence but to no avail....

Theres one guy I know of....Geekd, whose just using the airflow map to trim out excess fuel since hes running huge injectors, but to me thats not using the emanage to its fuel capabilities.



Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Tuesday, November 08, 2005 6:50 PM
So you can't add injector pulse width to the base pulsewidth set by the car because the emanage won't read the correct pulse width? If this isn't correct, spell it out plainly cause the last post kind of lost me.




Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Tuesday, November 08, 2005 7:54 PM
I basically cannot add fuel. Because the Emanage multiplies the fuel based upon the Normal Injection Duty Cycle, the Emanage see's it running, but only at 1%....anything multiplied by 1% is not enough fuel for me to even go into boost.






Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Tuesday, November 08, 2005 8:13 PM
Will the emanage work for the ecotec engine or is it the same problem
Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Tuesday, November 08, 2005 8:31 PM
I was just informed that even the newer injectors on the 2.4's are the same peak and hold as the 96...can anyone verify?

And yes it will work on an Ecotec...



Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Tuesday, November 08, 2005 9:26 PM
Eco uses 12 ohm injectors which are the same as the 00+ 2.4 injects, some folks have had issues with the eco and emanage



1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85





Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 7:51 AM
Listening...

I have been running e-manage w/o problems with the stock GM S/C injectors and I am confused as to why everyone else seems to be having issues.

Snosh

Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 12:11 PM
snoshfire wrote:

Listening...

I have been running e-manage w/o problems with the stock GM S/C injectors and I am confused as to why everyone else seems to be having issues.

Snosh


The difference is, people with 00-05 cars using high impedance injectors such as yourself aren't having problems but the 95-98 cars with low impedance injectors aren't having any luck...


- 93 mph in the 1/8 mile
Member of J-Body Of Michigan.

Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 12:30 PM
Skilz10179:
Thank you for clearing that up for me.

Snosh

Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 2:15 PM
Jay, what wattage resistor did you try wiring inline with your e-manage? Did you wire individual resistors into each of the 4 lines?

From what I'm reading on the E-Manage Yahoo group, they're calling for 10-ohm 10 watt resistors to do the job. Even so, thinking on the terms of simple electronics, I doubt that will rectify the problem. The other car's people are using currently have switch settings on their E-Manage that are in the Greddy E-Manage manual.

Here's my take on disproving that the E-Manage cannot support peak-and-hold injection.

Check this site out:

http://www.allmotorhonda.com/techpages/injector.htm

No, I did not look up all of the cars on this list but one in peticular:

1993-up Supra Twin Turbo Peak and hold 550cc

Top of the list taken from the main unit E-Manage manual:



Low and behold, there's the supra. I think this should show that the E-Manage does support peak-and-hold injectors. Now comes the question of whether or not the switch settings on the E-Manage are correct for pre 00 j-bodies. My guess is that the current switch setting everyone is using only supports saturated injection and not peak-and-hold injection.




<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 2:16 PM
lyndon wixom wrote:

with the e-manage ultimate you have to run high impedance injectors.


^ Yea, on pages 15 AND 16 of the ultimate install manual it says in very plain english that you need high impedance injectors or low impedance injectors with dropping resistors. I have no reason to think the original e-manage is any different.

I'm very surprised here, someone had to know this all that time people were discussing the e-manage. This is pretty significant.

Furthermore, any additional injectors must also be high impedance or low impedance with resistors added. That information is right out of the original emanage manuals.



Are you guys doing this and still having problems??






Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 2:22 PM
Well i wired 4 individual 10ohm 10wat resistors from radio shack...soldered them in to secure.... To the appropriate 4 wires running to the emanage.

As for the switches, we have tried switching the switches to see if we would get any changes but again to no avail...

All my info from the switch settings has come from jason Young...does anyone else klnow any different?



Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 2:26 PM
I think the switch settings are 7,4,2 currently on my box.....

but i see the supra is running 7,4,0....i know the second number is number of cylinders, whats the 3rd number represent?




Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 2:34 PM
Bah! Correction,

Ignore what I said about the Supra. From what I'm seeing, that chassis code is for the non-turbo model with saturated injectors. Here's a peak-and-hold example:

1991-up MR2 Turbo Peak and hold 440cc

According to my research, the 3S-GTE engine is indeed a turbocharged engine for the MR2. Hence, what shows up on this page:





<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 2:44 PM
Jay wrote:

All my info from the switch settings has come from jason Young...does anyone else klnow any different?


Here's the links to jason's settings (which I used for my 2k cav as well):

98+ 2200, 97+ 2.4L DOHC Diagram
http://www.cavyjason.com/2200emanage.htm

95-97 2.2L, 96 2.4L Diagram
http://www.cavyjason.com/2point2emanage.htm

Ecotec Diagram
http://www.cavyjason.com/ecoemanage.htm

Why do you have your's set to 7 on the first switch?? How did you conclude that this is the switch that you need? The 2nd switch is NOT the number of cylinders in the car since a Supra has 6 cylinders instead of 4. The switch settings on the E-Manage are all proprietary codes that are meaningless aside from lining up with a set of settings on Greddy's list of codes. Here's what Greddy says:



This is BS because the Supra's settings are 7,4,0. The Supra doesn't have 7 cylinders, nor do the MR2 or Corolla have 2 cylinders.

I honestly have no idea how Jason got a hold of the settings that he has. Greddy doesn't offer support at all to the end user. I'm thinking all he did was sit there one day and switch through the switches one at a time to find a code that works.

Once again, I think the key to figuring this out is to figure out the correct switch setting.



<a href="http://www.j-body.org/members/mrpute"><img src="http://www.j-bom.com/images/sigs/putesig.jpg">
Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 4:00 PM
Yeah I have mine set to 3,4,2

But even if, we establish that the switches arent correct...how in the world are we going to establish what they should be at!?



Re: Those with Emanage and low imped injectors...
Wednesday, November 09, 2005 9:28 PM
The high impedance injectors are saturated type. I don't think that the problem is the low impedance injectors at all. All the emanage does is hold a ground on the circuit after the stock ECU shuts off the signal. Thus added injection duration. I think there is some interference, feed back, or noise in the signal. Has any one tried to diode isolate the circuit?

There has to be a way to simulate a duration or trick the signal. I have had good luck with mine but it is a 99. and the electronics inside the ECU has to be different.

I think some diodes could help from current flowing the wrong way and giving a false reading.
Forum Post / Reply
You must log in before you can post or reply to messages.

 

Start New Topic Advanced Search