you say that the blood is on everyone's hands... saying that those that were killed were guilty as those kids. like those kids were doing something alright compared to them being picked at. i really would never want to speak to you face to face.. the fact that youre on here irritates me, but if you died i wouldnt put a tagline about it. what happens when a trenchcoat wearing freak gets on the nerves of 1000 people... someone gets rid of him. as much as i'd like to fall off of the face of the planet in my eyes... i dont wish you any harm. and i wouldnt have a comment about it to glorify what happened.
7 months without a date and counting
<img src="http://www.j-body.org/registry/agrosk8r5/personal_pic.jpg">
Chris Pauley aka wet nuts wrote:i believe you have the right to say you want, but open to the masses you should be censored so the rest of us don't have to see your bull@!#$ slogan preaching some gospel about how those kids were justifying something done to them
And I believe that you have the right, no the perrogative, to choose not to view this thread. And as KOTL said already (many times, in fact) he did not justify their actions, just saying that the "innocent" victims were not so innocent themselves.Maybe more "innocent" than the shooters, but not completely "innocent".
Currently #4 in Ecotec Forced Induction horsepower ratings. 505.8 WHP 414WTQ!!!
Currently 3rd quickest Ecotec on the .org - 10.949 @ 131.50 MPH!!!
so just b/c you and i are differing in opinions i can shoot you and its partially your fault..... nope
7 months without a date and counting
<img src="http://www.j-body.org/registry/agrosk8r5/personal_pic.jpg">
I just find it really hard to believe that there was "NO INNOCENT" victim shot or killed that day. Not only is it most likely there were innocent victims, there was likely more innocent victims then there were guilty ones.
Lets be realistic here. These two idiots did not walk into the school that day, look around for the guys who have been picking on the them, or the guys that gave them a swirly in the toilet last week, or the girls that laughed at them when they asked them to the dance. No, these losers walked in and opened fire in all directions, went to another room and did the same thing, over and over until they decided to turn the guns on themselves (the only smart thing they did that day).
So, of all the people shot, and killed, are you telling me that not one had never picked on, or made fun of the two gun men? Give your head a shake.
<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/gutty96/9c0c7e2f.gif" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
**there is only one true love in my life... and my girlfriend has learned to live with it**
On the legal scale, no.
On the Karmic scale, yes.
And how am I glorifying it? Glorifying it would be saying "the people shot at columbine got what they deserved" and did i say that. No. You're misinterpreting me.
Gutty: Huh? you lost me.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Gutty96 wrote:I just find it really hard to believe that there was "NO INNOCENT" victim shot or killed that day. Not only is it most likely there were innocent victims, there was likely more innocent victims then there were guilty ones.
everyone that day was innocent, they do what kids do, pick on other kids, youve done it ive done it everyones done it, its human nature.
they kids had no right to do anything they did that day, or did the kids deserve it one bit.
-Borsty
This thread stinks and I don't like it.
BTW Keep, a fella by the name of i64X is looking for you in Other Cars.
Skip says I have Frotteurism... I say I just thrust my hips at strangers.
I'm not saying that it would be partially my fault if you were to shoot me. The 2 shooters were, (I think we'll both agree) definately not innocent. The others, while they may be innocent of picking on, hassling, bullying, or degrading the shooters, weren't completely innocent either. They may at one time have stolen something, been racist, drank underage, or broken a series of laws. The point I'm trying to make is that noone is perfect. EVERYONE has some sort of flaw. Did the people at Colombine deserve to be shot??? Probably not. But on the other hand, did all the people walk around doing good deeds, obey their parents, never fight, argue, or slight someone in any way???Probably not.
Currently #4 in Ecotec Forced Induction horsepower ratings. 505.8 WHP 414WTQ!!!
Currently 3rd quickest Ecotec on the .org - 10.949 @ 131.50 MPH!!!
Quote:
everyone that day was innocent, they do what kids do, pick on other kids, youve done it ive done it everyones done it, its human nature.
You could take that to some very, very dangerous conclusions: to wit:
It has been "standard" for people of certian religious groups to forcibly cut out a girl's clitoris when she's between 10 and 13 years old--it's what those religions do. So, in this country, are they innocent of severe sexual assault even though it's what "their kind" has been doing for centuries?
Hence--there are no innocents, blood is on everyone's hands--EVEN MINE.
Sizz: thanks...i'll look him up.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
[quote=Keeper of the Light™]
Quote:
everyone that day was innocent, they do what kids do, pick on other kids, youve done it ive done it everyones done it, its human nature.
You could take that to some very, very dangerous conclusions: to wit:
It has been "standard" for people of certian religious groups to forcibly cut out a girl's clitoris when she's between 10 and 13 years old--it's what those religions do. So, in this country, are they innocent of severe sexual assault even though it's what "their kind" has been doing for centuries?
Hence--there are no innocents, blood is on everyone's hands--EVEN MINE.
human nature (boosting your ego by hurting someone esles) and morons in africa are two completely different things.
-Borsty
Believing dumb things you're told and carrying them on for the sake of tradition is human nature.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Hello... Anybody there?
These things happened, it's reality. If you hate it so much you should be working to figure out how to prevent this kind of tragedy, not trying to sweep it away. Discussion and debate will get people to think about it and maybe, just maybe, learn something from it.
Let's start with; be good to each other.
Don't let these deaths, innocent or not, be in vain.
PAX
i dont see any real point in your last post keep... these are modern day kids that act like kids that got killed while coming to school like anyone else. nothing more
7 months without a date and counting
<img src="http://www.j-body.org/registry/agrosk8r5/personal_pic.jpg">
[quote=Keeper of the Light™]Believing dumb things you're told and carrying them on for the sake of tradition is human nature.
picking on others is a natural thing its been done all thru histroy, selcude a group of kids from birth in a control environment with no one to go buy from example, id bet a million dollars that they would pick on a few select kids, not start multilation clitorisis. its part of the human pshcye, or however you spell that word.
-Borsty
My point is this:
Whether or not it happens and is part of "human nature", doesn't make it right. My point was that it's human nature to believe dumb things told to us by supposed enlighted individuals (history proves this). But it doesn't justify acts that still continue--no matter how grotesque or innoculous they seem to be.
As hahaha pointed out, the situation, as abhorrent as it was, happened. Now, kids, if their parents are smart, will tell them another reason as to why not to pick on other kids: because you nwever know which kid is a powder ked waiting to go off, and they. can. kill. you. whether. you. deserve. it. or. not.
In other words, the rules have changed since then. Saying that kids will always pick on other kids because it's human nature and because of that, no kids should open fire on their classmates is living in a fantasy world. It has, can, and most likely will happen again--whether or not my tagline makes a plity remark about it or whether or not it reminds you about it.
You have a choice: Either continue to point the fingers of blame at everyone else and sweep it under the rug because you can't handle the situation and hope someone else will, or turn that finger around, and start DOING something to stop it--like maybe going against "human nature" and on the personal level, be a semi-decent person rather than a son-of-a-bitch like everyone else.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
did u just call me a son of a bitch?
either way, the bottom line is u have that tagline
-to piss people off (which u said u took pride in)
-to get attention
-make drama (ie this thread or watever)
remove the tagline or become one of the 'son of a bitches' pissing people off for no good reason.
the tagline is unnessary, and that is the last thing I will say on the subject. good day
-Borsty
Lets analyze your tagline....
What happens when foul-mouthed chauvenistic white trash goes up against a
loner in a trenchcoat? The White-trash gets perforated (see also: Columbine).
Foul-Mouthed:
Did you ever talk to these people? Did you know those kids personally? Can you cite sources and examples of those children being overtly foul mouthed? What constitutes a foul-mouth? How many times do you have to say bitch, @!#$, @!#$, ass, cunt, slut, ass @!#$, whatever to be labeled foul-mouthed?
Chauvenistic:
By definition:
1 : excessive or blind patriotism -- compare JINGOISM
2 : undue partiality or attachment to a group or place to which one belongs or has belonged
3 : an attitude of superiority toward members of the opposite sex; also : behavior expressive of such an attitude
So were these guys either:
A) Foul mouthed patriots?
B) Foul mouthed social caste members, or foul mouthed members of thier school or family?
C) Foul mouthed people cynical of the opposite sex (as I understand, many of these "foul mouthed" people that got "perforated" were male, as were those "loners in a trenchcoat".
I don't see the people who died that fit into any of those categories...
White trash:
So what made them white trash? Again, did you know them personally? I know many people who would be overtly labeled "white trash" but knowing them personally they have more class than most rich snobs. Did any of these kids get brought up in the cliche' trailer home with 6 dogs, uncut lawns, many unworking cars, and parents that didn't care? I believe most of those who were injured or died came from upper middle class homes just as I'm sure you did, so are you also white-trash?
Loner in a trenchcoat:
Lets get this one right, they weren't "a loner" it was two "loners". So by definition, they weren't loners then were they? There were two of them, acting as a pair. If you look at the security camera footage, they also weren't wearing trenchcoats. So they weren't loners in a trenchcoat, they were two kids who were pissed off at the world, and wanted to take everybody down with them.
So, if you want your tag line to be historically and technically correct, you should use something more to the effect of:
What happens when middle class typical american kids go up against two emotionally unstable teenagers with stupid parents without gun locks? Innocent people die.
I got nothing against you KOTL, but your tagline isn't right, historically or technically, it is offensive to those who were involved (if your brother/sister/mother/dad/ect died in that, and you saw that tagline, would you support it?). The tagline isn't there to call attention to the situation, support the "trenchcoat" wearers of america, or anything else, its purpose is to have threads like this. The only reason trenchcoats are involved in the whole columbine thing is from the rumors and whatnot of those kids being involved in something called the trenchcoat mafia, nothing more.
4cyltuner.com - Information Source For 4 Cylinder Tuners
Buy stuff from CarCustoms Ebay! Won't be disappointed!
So Bortsy, you're saying it's okay for kids to pick on others, because that's what kids do.
Yet, it's obvious that that type of thinking leads to things like Columbine.
Who's more in the wrong? Keeper, who (regardless of his methods) is trying to discuss the problem, or you, who just wants things to continue on like nothing happened?
Sorry man, but regardless of his tagline, your line of thinking is flawed.
Hahahaha is right. This is why we talk about things like this. If you're so scarred over Columbine, then perhaps you should be working towards a solution instead of bitching about people who are at least trying to get the issue out there.
Maybe Keeper did it for attention, so what? At least he brought up the issue.
And I can tell you from experience, bullying is a VERY serious issue. I'm in the education field, and since Columbine (especially since Columbine) there has been a major focus on cutting down on ANY type of bullying. Kids being kids really shouldn't be an excuse for tearing someone's life apart. And it happens more than you probably know.
The thing is, bullying creates more than just the climactic carnage of school shootings. There are many more subverted responses to kids being bullied, mainly found in gang activities. Without going into specifics, kids being allowed to be kids, rather than being taught right from wrong is what is developing our culture of fear and apathy. If you want to just sweep everything under the rug and hope that everything will turn out sunshine and lollipops, you're the guiltiest of all.
If you're pissed off because of this subject, then good, you deserve to be pissed off. It's not something that people want to bring up, because it makes people take a look at themselves and makes them realize that EVERYONE is guilty of bullying at some point in their lives. It makes us feel uncomfortable and we don't like that.
Too bad, deal with it. If you don't like the way you feel, the try to rectify the situation by owing up to your mistakes and giving back.
There's a very good reason for him having that tagline--to make people think. Try it.
And for everybody turning this into an attention whore issue, grow the @!#$ up. Deal with the message, not the messenger.
And thank you again Hahahaha, for being a bloody voice of reason.
Did i go for historically accurate? Nope. An alliterative fact, yes.
However, i will disagree with the "innocent people die" if you don't understand my stance, read my previous posts. If you don't get what i'm trying to say, then there's nothing I can do about it--your view and mine then are radically different.
And if it happened to someone I was close to--i would not find it offensive. I don't get offended.
Anyhow, the powers-that-be have spoken, so this thread is will have to die a slow death.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
I didn't bother reading everything, but somehow i don't think that making fun of someone is an equal offense to mass murder.
If it is, let me know.
<begins smacking his head on a wall in frustration (much to the delight of the onlooking crowd>
I never in the threads said it was--in fact, i think i said multiple times that i didn't believe it was.
Let me try to summarize this, because i can get wordy:
Being the lesser of two evils does not negate evilness--the lesser of two evils is still evil.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
so why glorify either of them? evil and good are black and white; zero and one. life isn't digital, it's not an off or on situation. no answers are black or white. solutions are always in the gray.
don't be so quick to glorify the trenchcoat mafia, they weren't martyrs. they didn't die for what they believed in; they killed themselves out of cowardice.
as much as they got picked on by immature high schoolers, they should have just grown up and dealt with it. pass the blame all you want, but the finger rests on THEIR triggers.
again...point out where I glorified them.
Goodbye Callisto & Skađi, Hello Ishara:
2022 Kia Stinger GT2 AWD
The only thing every single person from every single walk of life on earth can truly say
they have in common is that their country is run by a bunch of fargin iceholes.
Shifted wrote:Lets analyze your tagline....
What happens when foul-mouthed chauvenistic white trash goes up against a
loner in a trenchcoat? The White-trash gets perforated (see also: Columbine).
Foul-Mouthed:
Did you ever talk to these people? Did you know those kids personally? Can you cite sources and examples of those children being overtly foul mouthed? What constitutes a foul-mouth? How many times do you have to say bitch, @!#$, @!#$, ass, cunt, slut, ass @!#$, whatever to be labeled foul-mouthed?
Chauvenistic:
By definition:
1 : excessive or blind patriotism -- compare JINGOISM
2 : undue partiality or attachment to a group or place to which one belongs or has belonged
3 : an attitude of superiority toward members of the opposite sex; also : behavior expressive of such an attitude
So were these guys either:
A) Foul mouthed patriots?
B) Foul mouthed social caste members, or foul mouthed members of thier school or family?
C) Foul mouthed people cynical of the opposite sex (as I understand, many of these "foul mouthed" people that got "perforated" were male, as were those "loners in a trenchcoat".
I don't see the people who died that fit into any of those categories...
White trash:
So what made them white trash? Again, did you know them personally? I know many people who would be overtly labeled "white trash" but knowing them personally they have more class than most rich snobs. Did any of these kids get brought up in the cliche' trailer home with 6 dogs, uncut lawns, many unworking cars, and parents that didn't care? I believe most of those who were injured or died came from upper middle class homes just as I'm sure you did, so are you also white-trash?
Loner in a trenchcoat:
Lets get this one right, they weren't "a loner" it was two "loners". So by definition, they weren't loners then were they? There were two of them, acting as a pair. If you look at the security camera footage, they also weren't wearing trenchcoats. So they weren't loners in a trenchcoat, they were two kids who were pissed off at the world, and wanted to take everybody down with them.
So, if you want your tag line to be historically and technically correct, you should use something more to the effect of:
What happens when middle class typical american kids go up against two emotionally unstable teenagers with stupid parents without gun locks? Innocent people die.
I got nothing against you KOTL, but your tagline isn't right, historically or technically, it is offensive to those who were involved (if your brother/sister/mother/dad/ect died in that, and you saw that tagline, would you support it?). The tagline isn't there to call attention to the situation, support the "trenchcoat" wearers of america, or anything else, its purpose is to have threads like this. The only reason trenchcoats are involved in the whole columbine thing is from the rumors and whatnot of those kids being involved in something called the trenchcoat mafia, nothing more.
gotta disagree with you there and let me explain;
a bunch of the soldiers in my unit discussed "what constitutes white trash" for quite a few months before all agreeing that
EVERY white individual has some degree of white trash. many have argued this belief, which is what it is just a belief that we all shared, and ended up finding out that they too were white trash.
I find this whole thing entertaining, first off, and I would like to thank everyone for a great read.
Now I don't think by what Keeper is saying is that he's supporting what the two individuals did. I don't even know what the statement means. I guess he changed it now so I can't look into it any further.
Two things annoyed me about this topic. One being someone stated the only thing they did right that day was kill themselves. To me there is something wrong with that. There is nothing o.k. about an individual committing suicide(no matter how hard you try I don't think you're going to be able to justify anyone's suicide). Couldn't it just be left that the entire thing was a mistake? Two wrongs aren't going to make things better.
The other issue that I have is saying that there isn't an innocent victim, not in this event so to speak, but in others. Such as, rapists wouldn't be in jail because the girl was always asking for it. For the sake of discussion on the whole karma side of things, maybe she did call someone a name a few days earlier, but does it make it right that she was raped? That seems a bit extreme if you ask me. Oh wait! There's that whole threefold thing. In that scenario if that were actually true, don't you think there would be a lot more violent crimes being commited? Everyone has done at least one thing wrong in their lifetime including me.
None of this really matters though because Keeper made the statement that he more than likely new was going to offend, and when it did offend he changed to suit the people he offended. At least in the process it was proved to me just how "goth" he really is.
