i was thinking about putting the 1 mm over sized vavle from car customs in my ecotec. my friend told me that since i need to machine the head so they seat right i should also do a port and polish. i read the guide. it isn't a how too. i was think about doing this to my stock head. i want to know what parts do i need, like retainer and such. i could change the springs in there too i guess. what do u guys think, and have any of you bought and installed those vavles.
heres the link
http://www.carcustoms.net/product_info.php?cPath=265_22_32_597&products_id=281
thanks
do cams while you have it apart
I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.
i was think about going turbo. so cams right now will hurt me.
RAKSJ04 wrote:i was think about going turbo. so cams right now will hurt me.
Not if you get a special camshaft grind that is meant for forced induction vehicles.
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
I got my valves seated for $100
i'm no ecotec guru. maybe adam NJHK knows this. but there are no available FI cams for the eco yet. He might know some good specs for you, or possibly a good way to get your hands on the cobalt SS cams... if those would work.
I was a retard, and now I'm permanently banned.
what i mean to say is i don't have the money for a turbo, and turbo cams will hurt you on a N/A car. plus i don't mined taking apart my car. i would pay some one to do it but then i wouldn't learn anything.
Spotabee Racing wrote:i'm no ecotec guru. maybe adam NJHK knows this. but there are no available FI cams for the eco yet. He might know some good specs for you, or possibly a good way to get your hands on the cobalt SS cams... if those would work.
You can contact JBP and they will find a camshaft grind for you. That SS Cobalt Cam swap doesn't sound like a bad idea either...
Also I think Comp Cams makes one...
RAKSJ04 wrote:what i mean to say is i don't have the money for a turbo, and turbo cams will hurt you on a N/A car.
Well yes, true. I was mainly responding because you didn't specify "turbo cams", I thought you meant camshafts in general.
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
Turbo, or non turbo, you cam for your intended RPM range. 'turbo'cams are a marketing scam. Whatever you've heard about overlap is pure bull@!#$. Its RPM range, period. I've built lots of motors, turbo, and non. Trust me, I know what I am talking about.
NOSfly wrote:Turbo, or non turbo, you cam for your intended RPM range. 'turbo'cams are a marketing scam. Whatever you've heard about overlap is pure bull@!#$. Its RPM range, period. I've built lots of motors, turbo, and non. Trust me, I know what I am talking about.
This should get interesting...
Personally I half agree. I believe more overlap is bad for a turbo engine, due to blowthrough/reversion (depending on pressure levels), but I don't think it's as drastic as people like to make it seem. Besides, the effects from overlap wouldn't be as bad up high, and seeing as you're running that kind of a cam, you're probably using the powerband higher up anyway.
I've heard of many success stories with radical cams on turboed engines too.
Also have to factor in the intake centerline (as recently brought up by jackalope, but not as applicable to a DOHC engine w/ adj cam gears).
<img src=http://hometown.aol.com/yogiandbooboo7/images/french.jpg>
NOSfly wrote:Turbo, or non turbo, you cam for your intended RPM range. 'turbo'cams are a marketing scam. Whatever you've heard about overlap is pure bull@!#$. Its RPM range, period. I've built lots of motors, turbo, and non. Trust me, I know what I am talking about.
I was about to post something like that. Just because its a turbo or nitrous ground cam doesn't mean you can't have it installed in your n/a car and drive around........I never got that about people on JBO when they said that. We have a nitrous ground cam from JBP sitting in the 4dr cavy until I can get my car down here to atlanta and the 4dr basically got a better top end now. Nothings hurt with the motor running N/a for now without nitrous.
OHV notec wrote:NOSfly wrote:Turbo, or non turbo, you cam for your intended RPM range. 'turbo'cams are a marketing scam. Whatever you've heard about overlap is pure bull@!#$. Its RPM range, period. I've built lots of motors, turbo, and non. Trust me, I know what I am talking about.
This should get interesting...
Personally I half agree. I believe more overlap is bad for a turbo engine, due to blowthrough/reversion (depending on pressure levels), but I don't think it's as drastic as people like to make it seem. Besides, the effects from overlap wouldn't be as bad up high, and seeing as you're running that kind of a cam, you're probably using the powerband higher up anyway.
I've heard of many success stories with radical cams on turboed engines too.
Also have to factor in the intake centerline (as recently brought up by jackalope, but not as applicable to a DOHC engine w/ adj cam gears).
Would a J make high enough pressure levels to make it a factor though? All I know is I've seen cars running around with turbo and nitrous ground cams without the turbo or the n2o. Yes it was for short periods but people around here seem to think it just wouldn't work period. I drive the 4dr from time to time and like I said it just pulls sick in the higher RPMs....
any comments?
..
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Coming Soon:HpTunersPro, EagleConnectingRods, WiescoPistons, 13sec2200
what about the 1mm larger valves and slight port and polish he asked about??? \
I am rebuilding an ecotec right now and I am also thinking about getting these valves instead of the stock size. and a slight port and polish.... like he said. Does anyone have the bigger valves?
2004 Cavalier
13.2@105........
Mods...
BFG Drag Radials
Saab Turbo kit
2.5 exhaust, w/cutout
Spec Stage 2+ Clutch
ECOTEC wrote:what about the 1mm larger valves and slight port and polish he asked about??? \
I am rebuilding an ecotec right now and I am also thinking about getting these valves instead of the stock size. and a slight port and polish.... like he said. Does anyone have the bigger valves?
I believe they suggest getting a 1 mm larger valves if you're planning on boosting because that will help even more with bring airflow into the motor.
All motor, it might be too big without raising the compression.
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
Quote:
Would a J make high enough pressure levels to make it a factor though? All I know is I've seen cars running around with turbo and nitrous ground cams without the turbo or the n2o. Yes it was for short periods but people around here seem to think it just wouldn't work period. I drive the 4dr from time to time and like I said it just pulls sick in the higher RPMs....
Like I said (its a bit of a pet peeve for me), you cam for the INTENDED RPM ONLY, TURBO, OR NOT. Turbo/nitrous cams are a marketing scam, like 'digital ready speakers' (thats a good one!!). The reversion, blowback thing, it just doesn't happen. As for the 1mm oversized valves, go for it. Its such a small change, that it won't hurt anything, and every little bit adds up to better performance. Just open up the pocket(bowl) under the seat are to compensate for the new valve size. When the machinist grinds or cuts the seat for the valve job, tell him about the 1mm o/s valve, and he can open it up a bit more with his cutter, or stone. Lap it after to see if you are getting seat/valve contact where you need it. It should cost less than a regualr valve job because he doesn't have to grind the valves if they are new.
NOSfly wrote: The reversion, blowback thing, it just doesn't happen.
Haha, sure. Saying it doesn't happen at all is very ignorant. Any pressure differential between the intake and exhaust manifolds, coupled with intake and exhaust valves being partially open simultaneously with allow blowthrough or reversion. Which one will depend on RPM, boost pressure, and tubine sizing vs. engine displacement. Regardless, they are there.
The effects shouldn't really be felt on a street engine however, because they will be minimal. But once you go to a crazy cam, you'll notice a significant difference in the lower powerband. Like I said before, it's not really applicable on race engines, as they don't use the lower powerband, and on street engines, they shouldn't be using such an aggressive cam.
So, just don't use an extremely aggressive cam on a turboed engine that you plan to daily drive in rush hour traffic without regret.
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Liie I said. You cam for your intended RPM range. Period.
do any of you guys know the flow efficacy of the stock ecotec head. i think that is what it is called. it is in % if that helps.
good Question!
2004 Cavalier
13.2@105........
Mods...
BFG Drag Radials
Saab Turbo kit
2.5 exhaust, w/cutout
Spec Stage 2+ Clutch
So you guys think that the 1mm oversized valves would be overkill on an mild N/A rebuild.
2004 Cavalier
13.2@105........
Mods...
BFG Drag Radials
Saab Turbo kit
2.5 exhaust, w/cutout
Spec Stage 2+ Clutch
You people bitch way too much about pointless @!#$. The question did not even mention anything about cams but here you all go, bitching more than my girlfriend is even capable of. Yes, it is part advertising, but there are also different grinds. Generally speaking, the biggest different between the n/a and turbo/nitrous cams is that the turbo and nitrous cams will open the exhaust valve earlier to clear out the extra stuff that was not intended to be there stock. And, Rick, its known as volumetric efficiency. Worth about 15-20 horsepower for every 5% increase. And it would be nice if anyone would happen to know what the stock numbers are and how big you can port the head.
Boosted 97 2.2L 5 Speed
Boosted 3.4L soon to come
NA is best!!
I'll have a sig someday....................
I thought of getting the oversized valves, but if you look at Patriot stage 1 and stage 2 head for ecotec. There's a 3-4 cfm difference between 1mm oversized and stock. I might be wrong, but couldn't you compensate the 3-4 cfm gain from oversized valves with a longer duration and higher lift on the cams?
Before you get a PnP.. ask the shop if they use a "flowbench". If they don't, then it would not be wise to let them do it.
i was going to do the PnP myself. and after i do that i am going to have them seat the vavles
bump. can anybody help me
RAKSJ04 wrote:bump. can anybody help me
I don't understand what your question is...
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