I'm thinking near and future mods here, for a 2.4L. From stock to built bottom end and 15psi turbo set up. First off, I'd like to be in the 14's (high 14's...) without doing mods that'll work negatively in a FI set up (i.e. N/A head/cam set up). Basically I want to do just about all bolt ons, then fuel comp/system to tune. Then work on the turbo set up, acquiring tuning skills in the process. So there's no need to do things twice.

First I was thinking Intake/Exhaust. I know the intake and header will be eliminated with the turbo set up, but they'll serve me well for a while. I'm thinking OBX header? And 2.5" exhaust, since I'll be using it with the FI set up. Magnaflow muffler, probably high flow cat. Pulley kit and ignition. What should I upgrade in the ignition exactly, besides plugs/wires? I'm assuming upgrading will help future spark problems from turboing. For fuel, what size injectors (should I wait until I turbo?) and afpr? And what fuel controller is working well with our cars? SAFC II or MegaSquirt? Any upgrades to the ECU? How do you get the speed limiter eliminated on the 2.4s? And rev limiter raised? I don't know what chips or tuners are best for our cars. And what clutch/flywheel setup,. and should I wait until I turbo to get that? Also, is there an LSD available for our cars? I should probably know a lot of this, but I'm looking for the best way to go, with the plans I have. All of this is happening, within 8 months probably. What is needed for 14's N/A with a good driver at 0 elevation? Thanks for your suggestions in advance.

If you want a built bottom end and turbo kit, you'll need mucho money. Why waste money now on stuff that won't work with the turbo kit? I can't answer all those questions, but here's my take:

Exhaust: Skip the header for now, but you can get a manifold-back system, either 2.5" or 3", depending how much boost you plan on running. This means the whole exhaust after the exhaust manifold, high-flow cat, muffler, etc. You can have one made a muffler shop far cheaper than buying a pre-fab, and performance will be equivalent. 3" may be too large for n/a (it'll bog your low end), but 2.5" might be too small for your turbo setup. Tough choice there. If it were me, I'd focus on my final goal and get the bigger one.

Intake: Intakes are cheap, and the cone filter can still be used with the turbo kit (perhaps even the intake tubing could be modified to work as well). A larger throttle body will benefit you with both setups. Same for a performance intake manifold.

Fuel system: An upgraded fuel pump, fuel rail, and FPR/AFR/etc would probably benefit your n/a setup and prepare you for the later setup. Injectors I'd wait on, the size injectors you'll need for the turbo would not be appropriate for n/a. Reprogramming/rechipping the ECU I'd probably wait on as well. Fuel and timing mappings are different. That would also take care of your rev limit and speed limit.

Electrical: Any electrical upgrades you do before the turbo will generally be fine. You'll probably want different plugs after the turbo is in, but those are cheap.

head/block/etc: Pretty much anything to do with this you need to wait on. Maybe porting the head would be fine. But compression ratio, cams, and cam timing is different between n/a and f/i.

Any suspension or drivetrain upgrades are fine to do beforehand. Flywheel, clutch, etc.

I'd suggest being patient and always remember your final goal before buying anything.

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What should I upgrade in the ignition exactly, besides plugs/wires?

you have no wires. so dont bother

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How do you get the speed limiter eliminated on the 2.4s?

there is a way. but no one here is gonig to tell you. unless you are trapping at 108 mph in the 1/4 but if you are gonig that fast, then you should already know enough about your car to get rid of the speed limiter

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I don't know what chips or tuners are best for our cars

there are no chips. the Jet, Venom, and the famous Ebay chip are junk.



sounds like you have some big plans. which is good. but with big plans comes with a lot of money. just do a lot of research to be sure you know what you are getting into.



Im a Xbox 360 fanboy...and damn proud of it!!

I plan on a 2.5" manifold back setup, most on here use 2.25" for N/A setup, and 3" is for a more serious turbo set up, so I'm going in between. How much of a gain, with exhaust and intake, will an OBX header give me? If it's enough, I'm still getting one until I'm ready for a turbo set up. Reason: $190 for a header is cheap, I'm used to $600-800 for coated headers for my Formula. I can the complete exhaust figured out, but what intake "is best". I know an Ebay intake might flow better than the stock box, but I'd rather put some that flows best on my car. What exactly do I need to break 14's N/A? And for a fuel controller, have the MegaSquirt or SAFC II worked best? I know this will take money, that's why it's an 8 month plan. I can do everything fine, but I do need some guidance on which route to take, and what exactly I should buy. And so far, I'm getting help, thanks.

mainly because you are asking....

what intake "is best"

and

how much will this give me....


to start the only way you know what something will give you is to dyno your car before and after.... then you will know the truth, and not a bunch of BS with one person saying this and another person saying that, and having both of em be EXTREMELY off....



but on the best, and what should i do....

read this post.


http://www.j-body.org/forums/read.php?f=2&i=215434&t=215434



if you actually take the time to read it unlike most, within a year or less, money permitting, you should be pretty far along.

if not, then you might be like some who have been here for years and still asking, what intake is best


but seriously, read up.

Ooooo- You asked the infamous "which intake is best?" question. Prepare for either the loooong argument that's about to insue (for about the ten billionth time) between the CAI and WAI guys, or rescend that question pronto and do a search and decide for yourself.

My humble .02- get a WAI. You're planning on removing it in 8 months anyway, so the couple of ponies a CAI may or may not net you (depending on who you talk to around here- I'm not taking any sides) is probably not worth the extra payola it'll set you back.

As for your exhaust- do it right, do it once. You mentioned that you want to run 15 PSI within the next 8 months. Suck it up, limp around for a couple of months on the 3" exhaust- that extra half inch will pay off in a big way once you're pushing that much boost- so you can either be slightly frustrated now for the loss of power, or frustrated later for double the cost once you realize you need bigger exhaust for the turbo and have it all redone.

Again, just my opinion. Take it or leave it.




I may not be the sharpest crayon in the box, but at least I'm a pretty color

only problem would be, if he turns out to be like the many who have said,

i will be running X amount of psi in the next X amount of months and never do....

-because the engine shop takes too long (common legit issue)
-decides to do something else hobby wise
-never has the money to do so....

3 inch exhaust will slow velocity enough to where the car will basically have no low end, so getting up to speed will be a lot more effort for the engine and more a waste of gas, especially if its a daily driver.

if anything WAIT on the exhaust.

prob should wait on most anything that you plan to eliminate and never use.... alot of people keep buying stuff and buying stuff and never have money to finish what they started, so the never get it done.

^^^^ Excellent point. Agree completely.


I may not be the sharpest crayon in the box, but at least I'm a pretty color

Haha, not a surprise to get that response, but that's why I put it in "quotations". I may as well just stick a K&N at the end of the OEM intake hose huh? Maybe I should have asked if it's worth getting a full cold air intake that puts the filter in the fender? I'm guessing there really aren't many dyno runs on the different mods I asked about, or I would have gotten a different response. The reason I'm doing 2.5" and the header (still) is because I'll be N/A for a while. And you're right about plans changing. Maybe I'll turbo it before pulling the engine and replacing the internals. And only run an 8psi setup for a while. But I basically wanted to get about as far as I could N/A (bolt ons) before I turboed, more to see what I can get out of the car than anything. If I can't use any of the intake, I'll sell that and the header afterwards. And I was trying to figure out an estimate of what I'd need to break 14's N/A with bolt ons, in a 5 speed car. Everytime I search, I keep getting info on Eco's.

I've heard tell of a well-driven OHV of Fury turning a 15 second pass with bolt-ons, so it's possible.

I guess the problem I'm seeing is that you have conflicting plans here. If you build it from the bottom up NA then you're gonna go high-compression for your internals, whereas if you want boost your gonna need to go low. 2.5 is too big for a 2.2L NA engine (with only bolt-ons, that is), and too small for the turbo setup- better to make your mind up and rock with it.

If you want to go NA for a while just for giggles and you don't mind the expense (which apparently you don't), You can-

ported intake manifold
ported TB
header (I've heard good things about OBX)
underdrive pulley
light-weight flywheel
intake of your choice (preferably 3" intake piping- make sure on that 2200 that the intake you choose replaces the resonator box on top of the TB, alot of them floating around out there (cough...cough...eBay...cough) just plug into that.)(PS- another good thing to check on the 2200 engine is that the end of the pipe where the filter attaches includes a 30 or 45 degree elbow 'cause otherwise the filter hits the hood, and breaks off of the pipe, falling down against the battery terminal, melting part of the filter and shorting the car...er.....- learned in the school of hard knocks.)
2.25" cat back with high-flow muffler (or header back if you want to run a test pipe and pray you don't get inspected)
high-flow cat of your choice (I don't know if Ractive makes one for our cars, but a friend of mine dyno tested a 3 hp loss with the Ractive cat vs open headers on an LS1 F-body. MagnaFlow seems to be a popular one with our crowd)(PS- the F-body example- by open headers I mean OPEN HEADERS- no exhaust past that, and with the cat it was headers into Y-pipe into cat into thin air. We crank-dynoed the engine while it was out of the car to get those numbers.)

That should get you started if all you want to do is bolt-ons, and you don't mind chucking some of it later. Good luck, let us know what you end up going with.


I may not be the sharpest crayon in the box, but at least I'm a pretty color

Kyle Struble wrote:Haha, not a surprise to get that response, but that's why I put it in "quotations". I may as well just stick a K&N at the end of the OEM intake hose huh?

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stock hose has ridges in it...ridges slow down air flow.... kinda pointless to add more airflow via a filter only to slow it back down with ridges, right?

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Maybe I should have asked if it's worth getting a full cold air intake that puts the filter in the fender?

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thats why i suggested you read the link.....

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I'm guessing there really aren't many dyno runs on the different mods I asked about, or I would have gotten a different response.

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there arent many for 3 main reasons....

-dynoes are used to tune engines more so than bragging rights....

-just cause one car dynoes X amount with the same exact part doesnt mean you will get the same so its kinda pointless to base another cars gain on how yours will respond. even in the same engine...

- dynos cost money... most people strap to get parts, much less test out every single new mod you add to the car. should really only use it for tuning. else you just really waste money.

an example of mods working differently on each car....




one person i know personally has supercharged an ecotec, best run to date is 16.3

justin cox with a 2.2 ohv with a 3 speed auto with basic boltons, ran 15.9


the one with the most boltons and forced induction still ran slower. HP isnt everything contrary to mislead beliefs.


on same engine vs engine, out of all the people who have added basic boltons with a 2.2L not many have cleared the 17;s much less 16;s....

justin ran 15;s


with 2.4L theres a post you can search "2000$ in mods and 16.1"

others have spent under 1000$ and dropped 1 second or two off their time.

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But I basically wanted to get about as far as I could N/A (bolt ons) before I turboed, more to see what I can get out of the car than anything.

probably not THAT far. but your money to spend or waste but some things may be able to be kept... TB for example.

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And I was trying to figure out an estimate of what I'd need to break 14's N/A with bolt ons, in a 5 speed car. Everytime I search, I keep getting info on Eco's.

realistically theres no set number of things to get into a certain time range. you cant really just go down a list and say this that and that will make me run 14;s.....and even with a 5 speed, you could be the crappiest driver alive and have the most mods, but still never make it.

basically keep adding stuff till you get there.

That's better! Joking... thanks guys. And the car is a 2.4L DOHC 5 speed, not a 2.2L. I wouldn't be trying to break 14's with a 2.2 without touching the internals/head/cam. And while I'm N/A, all that will remain stock, just bolt ons. If I do aftermarket internals/cams/head work, it'll be for the FI set up.

^^^^ My bad man, I'm a retard- don't know what malfunction had me thinking you were talking about the OHV. Good luck, and happy modding.


I may not be the sharpest crayon in the box, but at least I'm a pretty color