Ok I have done my searches and I can't find anything about doing this. So I am asking for help. I recently blew the bottom out on my sunfire and was wondering about putting the LE5 bottom on the L61 head. Has anybody attempted this or what are the problems that I may run into. Any help would be great.
thanks
ben
First off GREAT name
I am in the process of doing a hybird 2.55ish ALL MOTOR ecotec. Current plans is 2.4 crank 2.2 rods custom pistons with 90ish mm bore. First thing is to find the right cam for my project, weather it be the GM racing cam or the Comp Cam race cam. Then i have the check the piston/valve clearance with my current pistons and then adjust the valve depth of the new valve reliefs. Then have to order my custom 15:1ish wtih 90ish bore pistons, then check the piston/valve clearance again. Then install this engine with my kensler ITB to go along with my custom exaust. Then Dyno. Then go 12.50s @ 110mph, all before May 09
thats all for now
-Ben
Ben Wenzel Jr wrote:First off GREAT name
I am in the process of doing a hybird 2.55ish ALL MOTOR ecotec. Current plans is 2.4 crank 2.2 rods custom pistons with 90ish mm bore. First thing is to find the right cam for my project, weather it be the GM racing cam or the Comp Cam race cam. Then i have the check the piston/valve clearance with my current pistons and then adjust the valve depth of the new valve reliefs. Then have to order my custom 15:1ish wtih 90ish bore pistons, then check the piston/valve clearance again. Then install this engine with my kensler ITB to go along with my custom exaust. Then Dyno. Then go 12.50s @ 110mph, all before May 09
thats all for now
-Ben
me likey
Ecoclean wrote:Ok I have done my searches and I can't find anything about doing this. So I am asking for help. I recently blew the bottom out on my sunfire and was wondering about putting the LE5 bottom on the L61 head. Has anybody attempted this or what are the problems that I may run into. Any help would be great.
thanks
ben
you can do it. go standalone, pj's current project should help point out some issues you will run into. also check out ecotecforum.com as that has a specific section that deals with the hybrid swaps.
I have been looking into this swap alot.
You'll need a standalone. Also PJ speculates that it will raise compression due to the combustion chamber of the L61 head being smaller than the LE5.
I found that info plus alot more on here.
id love to do it, time to start lookin for a LE5 short block
It looks like im going to have to adjust my engine built timetable.......
Ben Wenzel Jr wrote:First off GREAT name
I am in the process of doing a hybird 2.55ish ALL MOTOR ecotec. Current plans is 2.4 crank 2.2 rods custom pistons with 90ish mm bore. First thing is to find the right cam for my project, weather it be the GM racing cam or the Comp Cam race cam. Then i have the check the piston/valve clearance with my current pistons and then adjust the valve depth of the new valve reliefs. Then have to order my custom 15:1ish wtih 90ish bore pistons, then check the piston/valve clearance again. Then install this engine with my kensler ITB to go along with my custom exaust. Then Dyno. Then go 12.50s @ 110mph, all before May 09
thats all for now
-Ben
thats great ben, but what does this have to do with the OPs question exactly?
ecoclean, I PM'd you back
will you be able to use your f23 trans that went to your L61?
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Mike wrote:The auto to manual swap is not as involved as you would think.
Get all the parts you need in a pile, and drive the car into it.
They will find their way into the correct places.
thanks. I will look into what you said about the reluctor wheel.
can that be changed with HPTuners. BUt then I run into the problem that I have the gm supercharger kit on my wifes car. And do I really wnat to make her car faster then mine. lol
hmm still going to look into it. but I may just put a l61 back into it for now. I just really wanted to make a gm Frankstien motor. lol I love the way that sounds
thanks guys for all the help and hopefully this topic keeps at the top as people experiment more
ben
Yep that damn reluctor wheel on the crank screws us for easy hybrids.
Have you considered swapping the whole LE5 including the cobalt ECU and sensor harness and guages over to the cav? It would take some serious wiring provisions, but 175hp to start along with a torque curve thats mile wide would be a sweet ride. Plus if you go with the cobalt ecu you get MAF tuning (easier for boost!!)
here's the issues with a hybrid of the 2.4/ 2.2:
-you have to worry about deck height and valve interface with the piston, especially with higher lift cams. I don't think it would be a serious issue, but would need to be checked out.
-you also have the differing circumference of the 2.2 head (86.5mm) vs the bore of the 2.4 (88mm) so you'd have a bit of a quench pad around the circumference of the chamber and it will cause a hot spot which could cause detonation, as well as a bump in compression.. and worst case scenario could hit the flat of the piston (that depends on deck height though, and I doubt its that close on the 2.4)
-I've heard about oiling problems with the 2.4 and 2.2 head when mixed together. Probably has to do with the lack of VVT on the 2.2 head
-the reluctor wheel on the crank is 60-2, whereas the Jbody ecu wants a 6+1 pattern. So you can either run a trigger wheel, or a stand alone ecu. Wiring in the cobalt stuff would be way more trouble than its worth.
but on the good side, the 2.4 uses the F23 trans, so compatibility there is a given.
the 2.4 also has a 6 bolt flywheel just like the 2.2, so there's no worry there either.
the 2.4 comes with or without the oil cooler like the LSJ, so you can get either or depending on how simple you want your install to be.
It works I have the setup running right now, well not RIGHT now but you get the point....
Its not running right, but from what I have got the quenching pad isnt to bad and Im not worried bout it, but I never thought about the compression being bumped up anymore, LE5s do 10.4:1 and L61s do 10:1, so I doubt it could be much more than 10.4:1
Hey Ben, where have you been? Ive been up to Motorplex a few times and havent seen ya...
now The L61 Powered Fiero
PURE DICE, PURE Design.Innovation.Creation.Excellence.
mmm well i have been racing up in kaleva @ northern michigan dragway 1/8 mile. other than that just kinda hangin around, started my second job for the year, workin as a supervisor for one of michigan sugar beat locations. after that i go to work on the red car, getting it ready for 09, thats kinda the overview
-Ben
PURE DICE (ecotecfiero) wrote:It works I have the setup running right now, well not RIGHT now but you get the point....
Its not running right, but from what I have got the quenching pad isnt to bad and Im not worried bout it, but I never thought about the compression being bumped up anymore, LE5s do 10.4:1 and L61s do 10:1, so I doubt it could be much more than 10.4:1
Damn, i have been beaten to it. I will be contacting you in the future.
i really wanna see hwere this one goes. dont let this project turn into scrap in your garage... MAKE IT WORK! and tell us what you had to do to make it work, in case someone else wants to tackle this swap
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Mike wrote:The auto to manual swap is not as involved as you would think.
Get all the parts you need in a pile, and drive the car into it.
They will find their way into the correct places.
There is the LE5 bottom end and there it is going into the car lol
Here is the best part of the LE5...
I doubt my issue has to do with the mechanical side, Im sure I still have a hidden issue within megasquirt.
I havent had the car insured this year, but did manage to "coast down the 1/4 mile track" with it lol. Im in contact for a few super MS guru's to come and take a ride with me before winter hits and see if I can come up with a solution. Not having it road legal probably plays a big part in how its running, being that my only tuning has been done in the driveway and my single run at the track.
If you want more info contact me on EF.
now The L61 Powered Fiero
PURE DICE, PURE Design.Innovation.Creation.Excellence.
PURE DICE - that's a wet dream right there!
For the OP, i still wonder after reading everyones insights on the hybrid swap, if its not just easier to take everything from a 2.4 cobalt/g5 and stuff it in the Jbody.
I had been seriously contemplating doing the 2.4 crank in the 2.2 block and thenboosting it but alas one project at a time.
Josh Cortez wrote:I had been seriously contemplating doing the 2.4 crank in the 2.2 block and thenboosting it but alas one project at a time.
I dont believe this will work, rod lengths I BELIEVE are different lengths, unless u can fab ur own or get a shop to make custom pistons/rods for you.
now The L61 Powered Fiero
PURE DICE, PURE Design.Innovation.Creation.Excellence.
mmmm custom pistons - i likey
-Ben
Ben Wenzel Jr wrote:mmmm custom pistons - i likey
-Ben
When are you going to invite me up to your shop i REALLY wanna see whats up.
now The L61 Powered Fiero
PURE DICE, PURE Design.Innovation.Creation.Excellence.
Well after talking to Karo and a buddy of mine who eats sleeps and breathes Ecotecs it can be done and will push close to 2.6L(not my math done by my friend). He was going to run this in his N/A cavy to compete against Ben and PJ but bought a GXP Solstice instead.
Chicken !
Bring it - i want someone on the org race - i get booted from the all motor class cuz im too fast
-Ben
