Has anyone had any of the following work done to an eco? Balance the rotating assembly and knife edge crank with the goal of removing weight, including disassembly and assembly.
I have a feeling it's not worth the money unless the motor is already apart for another reason. Are we talking hundreds here, or thousands? I understand the benefits are a more rev-happy motor, and possibly a couple horsepower recovered from the lost weight. The abilty to rev safely is the biggest benefit. A balanced and lighter assembly would also put less stress on bearings right?
Drawbacks, aside from cost, are similar to a lightweight flywheel. The engine will quickly loose momentum. Other than that i've not come across other drawbacks.
when I had my saturn engine balanced it costed 400 bucks, but that was everything balanced scat rods,wiseco pistons,stock crank,flywheel,crankpulley. Ive never even inquired about a knife edging a crank,so im lost on that one
knife edging varies between shops but i think $200-$250 is a good estimate for it.
and most shops are around $60-75 for balancing 4 cylinder pistons/rods. unsure on the crank, prolly another $75-100.
If it takes forever.... I will die trying. Underdog Racing
i just called about getting a rotating assembly balanced (crank,rods,pistons) and they quoted me for 300
RIP Cpl Derek Kerns And Cpl Robby Reyes
24th MEU VMM-261 (REIN) V22 Crewchiefs
11 April 2012 Morocco (African Lion)
$250-400 around here for most 4 cylinders.
Crank, crank pulley, rods, and pistons.
PRND321 Till I DIE
Old Motor: 160whp & 152ft/lbs, 1/4 Mile 15.4 @88.2
M45 + LD9 + 4T40-E, GO GO GO
damn you guys are getting raped.
i just paid $50 for my quad pistons/rods and $75 for the crank to get balanced. course it helps when the machinist is a friend of the family though LOL
really though, i called the local oreilly's machine shop to get an estimate on the same parts and it was $225.
mike- arent ur pullies fully balanced right off the cnc?
If it takes forever.... I will die trying. Underdog Racing
my guy charges 140.00 to balance a complete 4 cyl rotating assembly, ive never had anything knife edge so im not sure on the pricing for that.
mike
i make neons go fast
Wow, so much variation in pricing. Take away message is shop around lol. Are you guys quoting pricing with disassembly and reassembly thought? Or is this you guys taking in the rotating assembly apart from the block?
It would be awesome to get away with balance and knife edge for under a grand...
when i called and asked i told them it was all new parts and i would be bringing it to them disassembled and they would put it together and balance it and also to my knowledge if your using an aftermarket crank then most come with a mild knife edge
RIP Cpl Derek Kerns And Cpl Robby Reyes
24th MEU VMM-261 (REIN) V22 Crewchiefs
11 April 2012 Morocco (African Lion)
I disassembled my own...when I got the price of 400, I was getting everything balanced to 10k rpm so thats why mine was so high I guess. Also my stuff was getting sent to a professional shop about 50 miles away. To get a true balanace on a rotating assembly they need everything, flywheel,crank,rods,pistons,crank pulley.
so im lost what would vbe the benifit of balancing all of those parts?? i know its a noob question but from a technical stand point whats the benifit. and whats knife edging and what does it do??? and are these services done with the parts out of the engine?? just giving the machione shop your crank. pistons. rods and stuff. they dfo it without the rest of the motor correct??
Refer to the how much will my body work thread for the most accurate explanation.
Balancing is just like balancing a wheel. Off balance will vibrate and prematurely wear parts. Blueprinting is not necessary for our motors. That was mostly older motors. Knife edging is machining the crank down for less material so it is lighter. They do need the block to balance everything.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Tuesday, November 23, 2010 7:40 AM
how long does that usualy take??? like a day, three weeks? do they need the parts to be in the block or give them a disasembled block and parts....?? so its only to make sure it doesnt wear down.??? no performance difference?? is it catastrophic if it isnt balanced and i throw in a new crank pistons rods without balancing???
BuiltNBoosted wrote:Refer to the how much will my body work thread for the most accurate explanation.
Balancing is just like balancing a wheel. Off balance will vibrate and prematurely wear parts. Blueprinting is not necessary for our motors. That was mostly older motors. Knife edging is machining the crank down for less material so it is lighter. They do need the block to balance everything.
correction, you dont knife edge just for the sake of removing material.. you also do it so it cuts through the air and the power robbing oil that wraps around the crank (aka windage) at high rpm's.
no blueprinting isnt 'necessary' but if you are professional you do it to any engine, regardless of age. will it help? marginally in some cases whereas others not really at all, but at least you have the peace of mind of knowing its 100% perfect.
If it takes forever.... I will die trying. Underdog Racing
z yaaaa wrote:BuiltNBoosted wrote:Refer to the how much will my body work thread for the most accurate explanation.
Balancing is just like balancing a wheel. Off balance will vibrate and prematurely wear parts. Blueprinting is not necessary for our motors. That was mostly older motors. Knife edging is machining the crank down for less material so it is lighter. They do need the block to balance everything.
correction, you dont knife edge just for the sake of removing material.. you also do it so it cuts through the air and the power robbing oil that wraps around the crank (aka windage) at high rpm's.
no blueprinting isnt 'necessary' but if you are professional you do it to any engine, regardless of age. will it help? marginally in some cases whereas others not really at all, but at least you have the peace of mind of knowing its 100% perfect.
Blueprinting puts it to factory specs..... Depending on what you are doing whether it's nitrous or turbo or sc or na, you want your ring gaps different than they came from the factory sometimes. Not to mention different bearing selections available.
Main thing you see from not balancing a motor would be oblong cylinder walls, excessive wear marks, bearings wear out faster from the vibrations. Best bet to get it balanced. Yell you what, go knock one of your wheel weights off and drive like that for a while.....
lol so your saying something the factory even does isnt necessary?
to each his own.
If it takes forever.... I will die trying. Underdog Racing
z yaaaa wrote:lol so your saying something the factory even does isnt necessary?
to each his own.
the factory goes to general specs. thats it. a guy on a line measures it and passes it on if its in spec.
even then, i would want different clearances than factory if im building a motor... for example.... my ring gap tolerances would be different than factory due to compression and the amount of boost. bearing tolerances would be different due to the amount of cruising i would be doing as well as the amount of drag racing i would be doing.
still... its better to have a tighter engine with exact specs.. a production line can vary.
i prefer to take my time and get it just right. im sure todd did on the engine you have in ur car that he built.
If it takes forever.... I will die trying. Underdog Racing
z yaaaa wrote:still... its better to have a tighter engine with exact specs.. a production line can vary.
i prefer to take my time and get it just right. im sure todd did on the engine you have in ur car that he built.
EXACTLY WHAT IM SAYING.....
then why would you claim its not necessary on our engines?
you are contradicting urself.
If it takes forever.... I will die trying. Underdog Racing
No I'm not. Blueprinting is setting it to factory specs to the factory "blueprint" of the way it came factory.
You are agreeing with me when you say you would want tighter specs than the factory assembly line. Therefore you are custom building it to your specs.
So once we get an engine built, knowing its purpose and use, determines how it will be built. Unless you are trying to just factory rebuild, to which could be factory blueprinted, then you want custom built. Again, all this depends on the motors purpose.
Blueprint = factory specs
Custom = your personal specs
Should always be balanced.
BuiltNBoosted wrote:No I'm not. Blueprinting is setting it to factory specs to the factory "blueprint" of the way it came factory.
again... production lines can vary so not every factory engine is exact. so how can you say doing it to our engines isnt necessary?
thats all im getting at.. if the production line varies, some engines arent exact. so... when you rebuild you blueprint just in case! custom or factory specs, it still needs at least checked.
understand?
If it takes forever.... I will die trying. Underdog Racing
Of course brad, your right...............
Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Wednesday, November 24, 2010 11:47 AM
i could give a crap less whos right. its about giving people the best advice. thats
it.
If it takes forever.... I will die trying. Underdog Racing
