well here is the story.
my cousin has a 03 jetta with a k03 sport turbo. he is debating with upgrading the turbo to something bigger, maybe even the k04 (i dont really know). when i asked him to let me know because i might be interested in buying the old k03sport from him he said i could have it.
whether or not i get it for free or pay for it is beyond the point because i dont mind paying for it. what i want to know is will this tubo be ok on a 2.4 LD9? is the size ok? he said it was relatively the same size as a 16G mitsu turbo. know i know people have put 16g's on their j-bodies before and they have been ok, but maybe a little small has been the one comment i have seen.
i wouldnt be looking for big boost anyways. maybe 4-6 psi max. just something to add a little more umph to the motor and maybe get me closer to lets say the 170 hp mark. i dont have much for aftermarket performance stuff on my car, which is why im not looking for huge boost out of this thing.
ive read that the k03 is happy around the 14 psi mark and the k03 sport can flow even more than the original k03. i havent been able to find any graphs on these yet to see what the actual flow is like. even if i had the graph, i dont know that much about boosting yet that i could even make heads or tails of it at all.
so im posting the question on here, to see if you guys and gals know anything about the k03 sport and if you think running it somehwere between 3-6 psi would be worth it or give me any gains. i also dont want the turbo to be constantly spooling and i dont want to suffer from lag with my low modification motor here.
if i were to run this set up, what do you think i would need anyways other than the turbo. i plan on doing an exhaust setup in the next year. im probably going to go 2 1/4 inch from the cat back. even with the turbo i think the 2.5 inch would be too large, so i would rather stay with the 2.25 inch. i may be able to get his stock cooler too, since he said he wants to get ride of the small fender mount that comes stock for a larger front mount cooler.
let me know everyone.
rob.
1997 RedR - ZedR
waste of time... that turbo is TINY
iv got an airesearch m11 turbo off an audi 1.8 (very close to yours ive heard)
so ive been pondering the same question.
and also wondering why the compreser charge out has a 90* angle to it. does yours have this?
o but the way i see it:
small turbo.
no lag
lack of top end.
i have an auto to. i think a bigger turbo would be better cuz the tach snaps up so quickly, it would help pull that crappy ol' torque converter up to speed.
Listen F***ers. FASTERTHANAHONDA is a joke because I WORK FOR HONDA. I'll talk @!#$ about Fords to, that doesn't mean I can beat a 12 second mustang.
TOOOOOOO SMALLLLLLLLLL
Its too small on my 1.8L, its WAY too small for a 2.4. Granted, there's no such thing as lag with a K03, however, it spikes boost way too quickly and makes part throttle driving a real whore (especially with a manual boost controller, which, if you're contemplating using a K03, is probably the only boost controller in your budget). At 12-13 psi on the 1.8T its already overspinning. It takes 21 psi to get 221hp and 250 wtq out of my setup, and that dramatically shortens the lifespan of the turbo (the shaft is tiny... small shaft=small bearing area=overspinning BAD). As someone who's blown up two of them, get something else. And tell your buddy not to bother with a K04, for the money, and the effort to install a stock-style turbo, its not worth the gain. Been there, done that, got the tee shirt.
Arrival Blue 04 LS Sport
Eco
Turbo
Megasquirt
'Nuff said
thanks for the info everyone.
scarab - i dont know what kind of turbo he is thinking of going with. all i know is he wants bigger, so i would assume atleast a k-04. more than lilely he will go afermarket as i cant see him throwing on a stock style turbo unless the price was too good to pass up.
as for the turbo being too small... i know it is. its so small its cute looking. the reason i like that is virtaully no turbo lag. it should spool up nice and quick and give for a very nice low end powerband. now in the 1.8t's they use an electronic wastegate (at least this is what ive read) to some how help with that small turbo spooling up so quickly. this helps by making it seem still somewhat of a non-boosted engine under part load and highway type cruising.
if anyone has more info or if anyone has used this type of a turbo or something like a 16g succesfully on a LD9, let me know what your resluts are. keep in mind im looking for very low boost levels here. im staying under 6 psi if i use this setup and i will be getting tuned with HPT.
1997 RedR - ZedR
you really need to understand that there's a difference between "no lag" and "MAJOR, ENGINE KILLING TORQUE SPIKE". Ridiculous low end power is what snaps connecting rods. And I'm assuming you're thinking of this on a stock motor, since if you built a motor, you wouldnt even consider a K03. Not to mention I daresay that the M45 would put out less heat per hp than the K03. There's a very good reason that you see K03s used on ebay for $100 or less, even though they sell at $600+ brand new. That reason is because no one wants them. If you had a 1.3 liter, it would be a great turbo, but it is simply too small for a 2.4. I can get 20 psi at pretty much ANY starting RPM, but boost falls from 20 to 13 at redline, because thats how maxxed the turbo is on a ONE POINT EIGHT LITER engine. A 2.4 is almost adding 50% more displacement. Thats more exhaust coming out to spool a compressor wheel that simply can't fill that kind of displacement. I won't even get started on the "low end torque" thing either. A T3 60 trim is the absolute smallest I would go on a 2.4 and that will give you all the low-midrange power you want without seriously dying in the top end or making a ridiculous low-rpm-boost-spiking-twitchy-ass-annoying-to-drive-car. Trust me, I've used the K03, the K03S, and the K04. My beetle still has the record for fastest stock turbo no nitrous bug on Vortex and NewBeetle.org, so its not like I'm new to this. They are garbage turbos to begin with, and when you try to max them out it makes daily driveability a real bitch. And believe me, if you don't KNOW how to tune an ecu (and REALLY tune it), you'll end up blowing the motor quick because the boost comes on so fast, and so low the the first time you drive it around untuned you'll probably do damage. I may come off sounding like a douche in this post, but plain and simple, you do not want that turbo on your motor. I'm only trying to save you time and effort in the long run.
Arrival Blue 04 LS Sport
Eco
Turbo
Megasquirt
'Nuff said
thanks for the warning man. the only reason why im considering it in the first place is i can either get it really cheap or even free. if it wasnt for that i wouldnt even want it.
thanks for the info and your expirience.
1997 RedR - ZedR
You can get two, that would be ok..
well ive found a little bit more info on small turbos on bigger motors.
apparently the mazdaspeed 2.3 turbo motor used in the speed3 and speed6 is a K04 turbo. the K04 flows slightly more air than the K03sport.
that engine is more powerful than mine even in NA form, and very close to the same displacement as the 2.4 LD9.
just thought i would post it up as i found it interesting that a small little K04 is on a motor almost the same displacement as mine and does quite well.
1997 RedR - ZedR
Ko4 isn't all that much bigger than a Ko3 I drove a convertible beetle with a ko4 for about 6 months before I sold and I felt the turbo was still too small.
Hmmmm I always thought the mazdaspeeds had a T28 or T25 style turbo.
Way back in the day BMW had the 745i. It was a turbo 3.2(don't quote its around that size) that ran a Ko5 turbo and I have to say that is the weirdest looking turbo bolt patteren I've laid eyes on. The TCD shop 745 put down 300 to wheels daily driven.
There not useless turbos for small displacement engines but there horrible for us. Do what I did buy it cheap sell it to a freind with a SOHC Honda thats wants a quick turbo set up. You make back your money and a little in your pocket.
the mazdaspeed also has a ridiculously huge MAF table and way better engine management overall than a J-body. Not to mention an electronically controlled wastegate to smoothe out boost spikes.
Arrival Blue 04 LS Sport
Eco
Turbo
Megasquirt
'Nuff said
ya it seems with all the small turbos like that have an electronic waste gate, seems pretty common. as for the engine management and the MAF tables, alot of that can be adjusted with HPT.
either way, im going to get my car tuned first with HPT. if my cousin
Does end up giving my his old turbo and im still not satidfied being NA with HPT, then maybe i will consider boosting it with HPT.
Rob.
1997 RedR - ZedR
can't adjust MAF tables... you don't have them
although if you have a 97 you're at least lucky enough to have a speed density ecu. You can try it if you want, but the effort to fabricate a system around that turbo will be more effort than that turbo is worth... then, if you find out i was right and you're not satisfied, and want to upgrade, you've got to get a new manifold and rework your charge pipes again... another good reason to just go with a t-series.
Arrival Blue 04 LS Sport
Eco
Turbo
Megasquirt
'Nuff said
