God created Adam and Steve? - Politics and War Forum

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God created Adam and Steve?
Friday, May 13, 2005 2:36 AM on j-body.org
Some compelling evidence that seems to indicate that "sexual orientation is not all learned":

From The Toronto Star:

Brains of gays, straights react differently: Study

May 10, 2005. 01:00 AM


WASHINGTON—Gay men's brains respond differently from those of heterosexual males when exposed to a sexual stimulus, researchers have found.

The homosexual men's brains responded more like those of women when the men sniffed a chemical from the male hormone testosterone.

"It is one more piece of evidence ... that is showing that sexual orientation is not all learned," said Sandra Witelson, an expert on brain anatomy and sexual orientation at the Michael G. DeGroote School of Medicine at McMaster University in Hamilton.

Witelson, who was not part of the research team, said the findings clearly show a biological link in sexual orientation.

The study, published in today's issue of Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, was done by researchers at the Karolinska Institute in Stockholm, Sweden.

They exposed heterosexual men and women and homosexual men to chemicals from male and female sex hormones.

These chemicals are thought to be pheromones — molecules known to trigger responses such as defence and sex in animals.

The researchers divided 36 subjects into three groups — heterosexual men, heterosexual women and homosexual men. All of them were unmedicated, right-handed and HIV-negative.

Researchers studied their brain response to sniffing the chemicals, using PET scans.

The brains of different groups responded similarly to ordinary odours such as lavender, but differed in their response to the chemicals thought to be pheromones, Savic said.

When they sniffed smells like cedar or lavender, all of the subjects' brains reacted only in the olfactory region that handles smells.

When confronted by a chemical from testosterone, the male hormone, portions of the brains active in sexual activity were activated in straight women and in gay men, but not in straight men, the researchers found.



Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Friday, May 13, 2005 4:46 AM on j-body.org
OK, everything seems well thought out, and the findings are interesting, but WTF is the significance of all subjects being right handed???

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Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Friday, May 13, 2005 5:03 AM on j-body.org
Yeah the right-handedness is interesting trait to single out. I don't understand the significance of that either.


Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Friday, May 13, 2005 5:26 AM on j-body.org
Left handedness is caused by higher levels of testosterone in the developing fetus, and this could throw the results off for this test. The elevated testosterone accelerates the developing right hemisphere, causing left handedness.

Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Friday, May 13, 2005 6:24 AM on j-body.org
meh, 12 people in each group? Can that even be called a study?

Promise that forever we will never get better at growing up and learning to lie

Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Friday, May 13, 2005 6:46 AM on j-body.org
Yes, it's a sampling...

Have you seen the cost of MRI's?

Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.

Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Friday, May 13, 2005 2:29 PM on j-body.org
Oopsie... PET Scans

Right/left handed traits don't have any bearing on homosexuality, it's just an aggregate to keep the olfactory sensory area orientated correctly.. I believe I've read that the orientation of certain sensory areas of the brain is different in individuals who are Left-handed/Ambidexterous.

Apples and apples.. so to speak.

Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.

Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Friday, May 13, 2005 3:00 PM on j-body.org
for those that care enough to say homosexuality is "learned", where do you believe it was learned from?

Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Saturday, May 14, 2005 8:44 PM on j-body.org
This study is entirely a waste of time IMO, because it's results are obvious. People who say that homosexuality is a choice make me laugh. WHO WOULD CHOOSE TO BE DISCRIMINATED AGAINST AND HATED BY HALF THE U.S. POPLUATION?! And that's only assuming that there is a choice. But in terms of sexuality, there are 3 types of people -

1. Heterosexual - People who are attracted to people of the opposite sex. These people are NOT attracted, nor can they choose to be attracted to, people of the same sex.

2. Homosexual - People who are attracted to people of the same sex. These people are NOT attracted, nor can they choose to be attracted to, people of the opposite sex.

3. Bisexual - People who are attracted to people of either sex. These people are the ONLY people who can choose to engage in a homosexual or heterosexual(or both) lifestyle.

I fall under number 1. I am only attracted to women, and I CANNOT simply "choose" to be attracted to men. The simple thought of "relations" with another man, makes me sick. And yet I'm a man-magnet who's completely not attracted to men, and somehow I can barely get (attractive)women to look at me. This simply must be some kind of cosmic joke on me... I dunno. Either way if this was a "choice" at all, I probably would be bisexual - but I'm not because there is no choice.

Why is there no choice? Because attraction is a chemical reaction and nothing more. So just how do you "learn" a new chemical reaction? YOU CAN'T!! That's total .

As for homosexual males, for example, they are attracted to men, and only men. There is NO attraction to women, whatsoever. Homosexual women, on the other hand, are attracted to women, and only women. There is NO attraction to men, whatsoever. Of course homosexual men are NOT attracted to ALL men(this is a majorly widespread misconception), just a heterosexual men are not attracted to ALL women. Equally homosexual women are not attracted to ALL women.

I think that a large portion of the population is actually bisexual. Many of these people just deny one side or the other. For these people, it IS a choice, and most choose to be heterosexual. I'm pretty sure that most(nearly all) of the homophobes out there are actually bisexual, but are quite uncomfortable with their homosexual urges, so they live in denial and feel the need to overcompensate - by lashing out at homosexuals - due to their lack confidence in thier own sexuality.

As for me, I'm completely comfortable with my own sexuality, and I have no problem with homosexuals(in gereral). If you get over your own prejudices, and get to know some, you'll find out they're just like anyone else. Some are quite intelligent, some are complete dumbasses. Some are nice, some are jerks. Some are hard workers, some are lazy and worthless. Some would give you the shirt off their back, and some wouldn't give you a penny to save your life. Etc etc etc...

I've never heard of this "part throttle" before. Does it just bolt on?
Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Sunday, May 15, 2005 4:13 AM on j-body.org
I don't agree with homosexuality although I could care less what others do between the sheets, but its hard when the entire reason for gay rights etc...is centered around their bedroom activities. Because of my belief in God, I do not agree that genetics are involved when it comes to sexual preference. The only studies that I've seen so far are always done on homosexuals and heterosexuals. I'd think that the only way to properly achieve legitimate results would be to start when the individual is just a child and see if the same things that are there (genetic/chemical bla bla) then are there when they are a self proclaimed homosexual adult. It may have already been done, but I just haven't seen it so please someone square me away if it has. here is a good link that I found however....

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Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Sunday, May 15, 2005 8:50 AM on j-body.org

Actually, Gay rights is centered around repelling the discrimination against their choice in mates. And you're right, it's nonoe of your business what anyone does in their bedrooms, the same as its none of the employers, government or anyone else.

There has bee a study where laboratory mice had their brain chemistry altered to mimic what has been theorised to happen in homosexual people's brains during gestation. They were given a proportionate does of the hormones and the results were surprising at the time, IIRC they figured that extra estrogen would force a male to become homosexual, but it caused birth aberations, the same thing happened with testosterone. When they upped both hormones, they started getting sexual deviations... Pretty simple.

Again, I'm quoting from memory, I may be incorrect.

Also, I seriously doubt that any medical group would allow such a study as you proposed to happen, the results with rats were determined by vivesection.

Transeat In Exemplum: Let this stand as the example.

Re: God created Adam and Steve?
Sunday, May 22, 2005 5:30 AM on j-body.org
this is a simple thing, who in their right mind would choose to be gay? who would want to be a woman and go thru the pain, the suffering and anguish bestowed on them by their fellow man? NO ONE its not a choice its the cards life deals you, its at a core, i can list a very good example, one of my best friends grew up in a straight house, was never exposed to gay men or women, never watched gay men or women on tv at an early age, was never exposed to it in any way shape or form until after puberty by some years, as early as 5th grade he liked the other boys in class he says more so than the girls at the time, he couldnt understand why or how that could be his parents had mentioned gay people a few times but that they were sinners, or evil or sick perverts so he says he pushed those feelings aside and tried to launch into man mode and make up for it, years later after long anguish he finally admitted to all his friends that he was bisexual, he claims it was a huge relief, like a weight had been taken off him he often kids that half that weight was the so called friends that turned their backs on him but i think its pretty sad they did it in the first place, hasnt changed my mind about him at all, hes a nice guy and has never done anything wrong to me, oddly enough he says and from what i've seen, most women are actually turned off by bisexuals, as are gay men so they have none of the support group that full blown gay men seem to have, sad really even amongst like minds they still bicker, i had a bunch of friends that were gay as well and they were all nuts but in a fun way, had alot of fun with them, very respectful of my preferences and never said anything about it. so i would deffinatly have to challenge the idea that being gay is learned or created, i've seen no proof to show that, and more and more research is showing that its not a choice. so wake up america hug your neighbor, who knows you might like it

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