Yeah, I saw that post. I'm planning on running that setup on both my motors (I won't trust the plastic manifold with the high manifold pressures), but I know there are people looking for a no-machining, no welding solution. I'm just want to help them out
I was actually going to run the used del west Ti valves w/ 5/16" stems, and then use some crane Ti retainers that fit the LS1 springs, and some Crane locks that fit 5/16" stems to those specific retainers.
I haven't been able to find any del west retainers that would work with such narrow -based dual springs...If I could find some of those that would also work with 7mm stems, I'd be all over them...although Ti valves sound mmmmmmmmm.
Although, those valves/retainers/keepers are so cheap, I could probably have the valves cut down for about the same price as some stainless valves new, right?
fortune cookie say:
better a delay than a disaster.
Del West is one of the few places, if you want it they will make it and
you will pay for it! $$$$$$ All of it is top quality though. Maybe theres a reason the NASCAR teams use them in the OHV V8s that turn 9400rpm + on a regular basis! And they usually hold up for up to 600 miles at those rpms.
the springs, locks, and retainers are all JBP. So is grinding not an option? ya think i should go with the magnum rollers?
Phlatcav, grinding is not the answer. Check the locks and reatiners again. Also check the stem installed height as well as the depth of the seat. Something was missed.
-->Slow
lowfire's setup is going to be ridiculous. (in a good way)
I have a tig welder on hand at work to do my top feed conversion, so this is costing me all of $80 (except for the injectors)
I have a grinding booth with a downdraft table as well.
the locks and retainers are installed correctly. I do not think that JBP counted on crane 1:6 not reaching the stem. PJ also had the same issue so I do not belive its an installation issue. The springs + locks + retainers were all installed by AMR engines and tested to insure the proper spring rate and valve clerance.
I fail to see why removing material (and it would not take much) would affect anything at all.
MadJack wrote:
As far as porting the head, yes keep the flow vane (ridge) in the exhaust port. It's there to keep the exhaust velocity up and to prevent reversion (back flow). The bigest improvement in a port job, comes from the bowl blend just above the hardend valve seat and around the valve guides in the port area, keeping in mind the fluid flow and the direction of flow. Reduce the amount of material around the guide and shape it kinda like an airplane wing, rounded at the frontal area and tapered afterward.
.
Well I guess I jus messed up my head. Cause I was around messing in the shop and was grinding away on the head. I removed those little ridges. Damnit.....
http://registry.gmenthusiast.com/images/importkilla32/Bullit.JPG
I feel left out...I know nothing about pushrods and OHV engines...good reading though
can you get these for the 2200 and the right studs? and are the gains the same as the crane rollers?
The installed height on mine is fine, but they're not the chromoly retainers and locks like you have. I'm sure JBP was just adapting parts from other engines, and probably didn't consider whether they'd work with the Crane full-rollers. I think your best bet is to go with some lash caps as mentioned (maybe this is why JBP has lash caps on their site). Then you'd need pushrods that are longer by the thickness of the lash caps of course. I wouldn't give up the rockers if I were you.
MadJack: I would never be able to convince myself to shell out that kind of $$$$ for valves (having enough trouble for the crank). What are the chances a machine shop could turn the valves down on a lathe to resonable tolerances?
fortune cookie say:
better a delay than a disaster.
but all in all what would i affect by shaving that down!? i have spent way to much on this valvetrain as it is and already have purchased pushrods. I simply would like to know how taking some material off in those areas could even affect anything as long as the roller on the rocker is contacting the stem.
I have no idea how it could affect it, but I know things like that often lead to big headaches. Remember, pushrods are very cheap compared to the other stuff. But like they said, you could run some locks that will give you a shorter installed height (the correct installed height, as that is obviously off...assuming those valves are stock length). Maybe try
these. They look like they'd give you the same amount of valve stem as mine are showing since they have the groove at the end of the lock instead of the middle. That should kick the retainer down a tad and solve the problem (and they're cheap too... & titanium
)
fortune cookie say:
better a delay than a disaster.
yea but the JBP retainers are larger than stock, as are the keepers (locks) so who is to say that those would fit them? also by doing that the spring rate would also change.
honestly it kinda looks like the comp cams magnum rollers would be my best bet as they do not have a large rcoer body like the crane and should affer that same performance. BUT will they fit a newer 2200 with an 8mm rocker stud base?
damn sorry for 3 post....
but PJ has the same JBP springs, locks, and retainers as i do and he had the same problem as me, so i dont think its an install error
wanna buy them so i can move on
I don't know how it could be an install error...never said it was. I said those locks won't work with those rockers. Yes, you can use magnum rockers (have to use a 3/8" upper thread though...part number is in the LS1 rocker thread I believe), but you lose the advantage of the needle-bearing pivot point (the main source of reclaimed power).
You are kind of right. You wouldn't actually change the spring rate, but you will have a higher installed load (but it would be very minimal, and with those springs, you would still be nowhere near binding). Also, if you're using the JBP spring shims, you can remove them to get you back to normal loads. It looks like 7* locks are pretty much universal from what I've seen so far. The problem is that I just looked up the JBP parts, and they use 10* seats. Therefore, I'd go to summit's website and buy MAN-13171-8. They are Manley's machined steel (probably better than what you have now) 10* 7mm locks for an installed height of .050" less. It's $30 per unit, and includes 8 pairs (what you need)...much cheaper than new lifters, and even cheaper than new valves.
fortune cookie say:
better a delay than a disaster.
great idea!!!!
however im not using JBP shims but i am using shims (very thin). you think i can remove the shims and run the keepers from summit and be ok?
do you still have a steel footprint under the spring? you don't want the spring to sit directly on the aluminum head or it will wear it away. As long as you have a steel footprint, you should be fine just using the new locks. Like I said before, that little bit of extra compression won't really make a difference anyway.
That's it for tonight, I'm almost out of posts already, and I have a final in less than 8 hours that I have yet to study for
long live the all-mighty OHV
fortune cookie say:
better a delay than a disaster.
do you know for a fact that the manley keepers have the lip at the top? if so im ordering them soon as you so go
well this sucks, i dont know if the steel footprint is still there, all i see is the shim (i was not there when the head was assembled), all i can pysicaly see is the shim. So basicly i have no clue
.
i need a solution
I'd say the best thing you can do right now is to take a trip over to your nearest Advanced Auto branch, and take advantage of their free loan-a-tool service. Rent a valve spring compressor and take apart one of your assemblies so that you can know for sure exactly what's there shim and seat wise. If you need some new seats, I have a spare you can have.
And yeah, since they're .050" less installed height, they'd have to have the bead on the top...I really don't see any other way they could accomplish that. And the pic on JBP shows their bead is about 20% of the way down, so a bead on the top should most definately solve your problem.
If you are REALLY worried about the extra load from the lower installed height (but there's no reason to be), you could probably have a machine shop take the seats down. If you take one assembly apart and measure the unsprung spring length, and installed height, I can tell you how much extra load you'll have (JBP lists ~190lb/in, so in actuality, you could probably use the added load
).
fortune cookie say:
better a delay than a disaster.
