What RSM offers and what JBP offer are two totally different things. While RSM just offers a reflash the run with their supercharger... totally faith based... JBP offers modification to any aspect of the computer. It is very easy to test this as all you have to do is ask for a raised rec limiter or speed limiter...... if they can do that then they are no joke. They wouldn't even offer that knowing that anybody buying the reflash would raise both and it could be easilly shut down.
I really don't think that JBP is BSing about the reflash... with HPtuners now out they should probably lower the price but it is most likely not BS and never was. They may have been the HPtuners test bunny even for the software, maybe they used Tech II.... Either way, it is more tha possible and you all shouldn't be so fast to accuse.
Cardomain|
Myspace
It just amazes my the leaps of faith some people will make without any real information to back their belief up.
My statement was far more rhetorical than anything.
I doubt the JBP reflash will ever be checked for one simple reason--- no one has ever seen anyone with it.
It would probably be easier to check the reflash of a unicorn than ever check JBP's. (For the "true believers" out there let me clarify that a unicorn is a mythical non-existent animal that is not computer controlled nor does it even have a PCM to anyone's knowledge.)
I do not believe that JBP should have to prove anything about their products. The situation is simple free enterprise. Its the responsiblilty of any potential customers to make that decision themselves. Caveat emptor is the matter of course there.
What I do request, though, is if the "true believers" could please quit trying to shout down everyone who questions any product without ever owning or even seeing the product themselves.
Example from above...
Quote:
They may have been the HPtuners test bunny even for the software, maybe they used Tech II....
No, they weren't the testers for HP. No, the Tech 2 is not capable of what you are suggesting. What you have done with those statements is spread new, inaccurate information.
The fact is that there has not been any basis presented ever on this forum that shows JBP products to be worth anything. There has been a few instances that show that, maybe, building engines is not a product they should be focusing on. There have been no instances that show they should be building engines.
Many people shout "this is why we can't get any decent products for our cars" whenever someone posts anything that says something like this. Again, this is based on no evidence.
Someone show me one instance of a proven, reliable, and capable set of products that any company has produced for our community that has resulted in the company going out of business. Same goes for the customer service end of the business.
I will always ask for, or test for, proof that a product is what it claims to be.
I will respond accordingly whenever people with no evidence present their opinions as fact.
Quote:
JBP offers modification to any aspect of the computer. It is very easy to test this as all you have to do is ask for a raised rec limiter or speed limiter...
Your statement is entirely correct.
Now show me the car that we can see this on. Present the actual evidence.
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^^^^^^^It's common sense........ They wouldn't sell something that is completely obvious to dissprove.
RSM hid behind the fact that they never had to say exactly what they did with their reflash. JBP offers to modify anything you ask for and specifically stated rev and speed limiters, which again would be totally ovbious if they didn't actually do anything to the ECU.
Now why do you say it can't be done with a tech-II programmer? I only threw that out there as a possibility and it deffinately is.
Test bunny for HPtuners, I never said it was true, just a possibility and I can assure you that you do not know for a fact either way unless you are part of JBP or HPtuners... so sorry but no you can't shut me down there. Spreading missinformation does not apply to thought up possibilities.
Anyway, I am going with my original statement... it would be absolutely moronic to say "we can take off your speed limiter," let people buy it, and ship them back their computer without doing anything to it..... The only reason nobody has their reflash is that nobody on JBO was willing to buy it.. there may be someone out there with it but not on here.
Cardomain|
Myspace
M I N I O N - Sinbird wrote: ^^^^^^^It's common sense........ They wouldn't sell something that is completely obvious to dissprove.
Many others have done exactly that, what makes this situation different?
M I N I O N - Sinbird wrote: RSM hid behind the fact that they never had to say exactly what they did with their reflash.
Neither does JBP.
M I N I O N - Sinbird wrote: JBP offers to modify anything you ask for and specifically stated rev and speed limiters, which again would be totally ovbious if they didn't actually do anything to the ECU.
RSM made exactly the same claim, too.
If you can't show me a vehicle that JBP has done this to, then it simply means they haven't actually done it.
M I N I O N - Sinbird wrote: Now why do you say it can't be done with a tech-II programmer? I only threw that out there as a possibility and it deffinately is.
No, it can't do that. You are completely wrong in your statement. Therefore it is not a possibility.
M I N I O N - Sinbird wrote: Test bunny for HPtuners, I never said it was true, just a possibility and I can assure you that you do not know for a fact either way unless you are part of JBP or HPtuners... so sorry but no you can't shut me down there. Spreading missinformation does not apply to thought up possibilities.
Wonderfully stupid logic there.
I made something up and you can't disprove it easily, therefore I am correct. Here's my logic... JBP has made this claim well in advance of HP even thinking about offering J support. I do know this as fact as I had been on the phone with them well before all the Org polls and posts. Also, friends of mine had been involved with the development.
M I N I O N - Sinbird wrote: Anyway, I am going with my original statement... it would be absolutely moronic to say "we can take off your speed limiter," let people buy it, and ship them back their computer without doing anything to it..... The only reason nobody has their reflash is that nobody on JBO was willing to buy it.. there may be someone out there with it but not on here.
No evidence = no proof
I have seen many other similar claims that were easy to test.... 20hp "chips" for you car, $40 electric superchargers that offer 20-30% gains, and many people building "500hp" engines. None of which ever match the claims.
Feel free to believe anything you chose to believe. WC Fields said "a sucker is born every minute".
But at least have the decency to stop trying to convince others to put their money on the line when you simply haven't and won't do so yourself.
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M I N I O N - Sinbird wrote:^
Now why do you say it can't be done with a tech-II programmer? I only threw that out there as a possibility and it deffinately is.
the tech 2 is a hand held scan tool , and will only change paramiters that are allowed to be changed , ie... in my 97 cav i turned the drl's off because the IP had that option
now the tech 2 is used to reflash the pcm , but it has to upload a program from GM's system , and those programs do not have any windows to alter the rev limiter or speed limiter or fuel maping , because GM DOESNT want that done
the tech 2 can only do what GM will allow it to do , and nothing more
little more indepth than todds reply to help you understand what the tech 2 does
I'd never actually heard of JBP before this thread.
That being the case... has anyone actually had them reflash their ECU? Todd is implying that nobody has. Those of you who are backing them... do you have their ECU reprogramming?
Chris? Have you got it?
I'm just flat-out curious here.
brian you trying to copy jake ????
lol
WW youve never heard of JBP - J-body performance
::sigh::
logic obviously isn't your thing......
I get the point, you're THE Todd Miller and I'm not.
Cardomain|
Myspace
M I N I O N - Sinbird wrote:::sigh::
logic obviously isn't your thing......
I get the point, you're THE Todd Miller and I'm not.
whatever do you mean ? we're talking about teh JimmyZ here ! EVERYTHING is his thing
15.574 @ 89 mph stock without charger. new times with charger coming soon.
HEY HEY HEY!! Anyone near Reading, PA want to test my car? The previous owner had the RSM supercharger kit (and reflash) on the vehicle. I guess it was one of the first OHV 2200's to see the kit. It was Travis McNaulty's car. I'll gladly drive a little (~100mi) to meet up if there's anyone around that has Hp tuners (maybe some of the York, PA guys?).
The previous owner parted out the kit before he traded it in on an '05 ecotec. But you cannot part out a reflash. I was always curious how the car ran so well with a "reflash" designed for 8 psi of boost...without the boost. My only condition to testing my car is not to screw it up. rwl041@netscape.net
Why would you want your car checked? It's been proven RSM's "reflash" is a fraud. What people are seeking now is a JBP "reflash".
14.330 @ 96.37mph
its worth it to check more than 1 pcm reflash from either company
its always possible the reflash never took
is it just me or is this argument compleatly stupid until someone checks a jbp flashed ecu?
btw has anyone ever even bought a jbp ecu?
and I think the most important question is why the hell do you people care? are you going to buy one of there ecus even if they are flashed (no your going to hump hpt) so whats the big deal?
"
boobs now with Riboflabin"
Scarab (Jersey Jay 1.8T) wrote:but as a comparison, VW still does not have ANY type of performance reflash, yet they are available in DROVES from the aftermarket. So, just because the VW dealer can't do it, does that make it unlikely that an aftermarket company could do it?
Actually we can do it.... we sell and install GIAC flashes, we chip brand new dealer stock GTI's, Jetta's and Passat's as well as customer cars, customer cars ranging form VW's all the way up to GT3 Porshces. And we sell performance parts and install them as well, intakes, short throw shifters, suspensions, exhausts, diverter valves, ect... Oh and we specifically a VW dealer, no other car lines except used cars (we get everythign form Ferraris, Porshces, Lambos, Chargers, lately high end Mercedes we just sold a renntech twin turbo V12 CL6XX, Audis, vettes, alot of high end cars and we mod those to, usually just suspension and wheels)
not that adds anythign to the coversation but I saw that and had to comment on it
Quote:
Why would you want your car checked? It's been proven RSM's "reflash" is a fraud. What people are seeking now is a JBP "reflash".
ONE unit is not definitive proof. It's enough to make everyone very suspicious though. Why not confirm the fraud by testing out every reflashed PCM that people are willing to test? I'd say once you see that two or three are fake, it's class action time!
Does it go faster?
Blown DanteMustDie wrote:bah, some companies just don't care about forums and prefer to base their reputation on their customers satisfaction only... it might not be the best thing for them but to each their own...
it's easy to say that since they don't respond they must be screwing us but the fact is they don't HAVE to answer at all... so someone just get your ECM reflashed by them and then post the results...
it's called put up or shut up...
I run a very succesfull business manufacturing high performance parts.
I take my business very seriously, back my parts with a 100% money back gaurantee, and the best warrany in the business.
While trying to help some fellow members, (and simultaneously) develop several parts for 2.4's(at
much better pricing than you are paying now), I was flamed, ridiculed, and accused of
a) not knowing what I am talkiing about
b) not even being in the business that I claimed.
This was spearheaded by a know-it-all mouthpiece that was/is very ill informed, and really had NO idea what he was talking about. The problem was, everybody sided with him, and congratulated him on making me look like a fool.
Sad to say, development on 2.4 parts have stopped.
My business can't afford to spend alot of serious development time, and effort, and in the end, just be ridiculed by the 'community'.
There was alot of quiet support, but I learned my lesson, and Mev, likely has too.
He will be smart to not say anything, and just stay away.
I learned. Once you get attacked, even by an idiot, you can't win.
^^ Add your company to the list that now includes Exploited Racing, Maximum Boost, and now RSM racing. When you look at it the way that you are, JBP is really doing the best thing by not commenting, because someone in this "community" will definately find a negative in whatever they say. While these companies offer(ed) strong support for the JBody platform, they were basically flammed out of that market by this website. Who knows if they had a product that worked well, because either not many people bought them, or those that used them effectively never shared here, only those that had a problem.
This is all not to say there are not crappy products out there, because we all know there are. But its a shame that every time an upstart tries to introduce something, memebers of this board find it and eventually kill it. I've been frequenting this forum for about three years now (since i became a 3rd gen owner), and really the only companies that make a strong array of performance parts specifically for our cars AND survived this site are JTuners (formerly cav connection), CarCustoms, and JBP. Now with the JBody platform out of production, new companies are less likely to focus on them. Just my 2 cents...
Does it go faster?
turbo shadow wrote:Blown DanteMustDie wrote:bah, some companies just don't care about forums and prefer to base their reputation on their customers satisfaction only... it might not be the best thing for them but to each their own...
it's easy to say that since they don't respond they must be screwing us but the fact is they don't HAVE to answer at all... so someone just get your ECM reflashed by them and then post the results...
it's called put up or shut up...
I run a very succesfull business manufacturing high performance parts.
I take my business very seriously, back my parts with a 100% money back gaurantee, and the best warrany in the business.
While trying to help some fellow members, (and simultaneously) develop several parts for 2.4's(at much better pricing than you are paying now), I was flamed, ridiculed, and accused of
a) not knowing what I am talkiing about
b) not even being in the business that I claimed.
This was spearheaded by a know-it-all mouthpiece that was/is very ill informed, and really had NO idea what he was talking about. The problem was, everybody sided with him, and congratulated him on making me look like a fool.
Sad to say, development on 2.4 parts have stopped.
My business can't afford to spend alot of serious development time, and effort, and in the end, just be ridiculed by the 'community'.
There was alot of quiet support, but I learned my lesson, and Mev, likely has too.
He will be smart to not say anything, and just stay away.
I learned. Once you get attacked, even by an idiot, you can't win.
I agree completely with everything you said especially that last sentence... I have never done business with, contacted, wanted to buy their products, cared that they are a canadian company, or even felt the need to support them.... yet people choose to read too much in posts and turn it however they want it to.... with the results displayed in this thread.
imagine that the attacker is also a moderator in said forum, and you'll understand why it has been a bit more than 24 hours since I last posted...
15.574 @ 89 mph stock without charger. new times with charger coming soon.
I run a very succesfull business manufacturing high performance parts.
I take my business and hobby very seriously, back my parts with a 100% money back guarantee, and the best warrany in the business.
While trying to help some fellow members, (and simultaneously) develop several parts for any automotive enthusiest, I was flamed, ridiculed, and falsly accused of
a) not knowing what I am talkiing about
b) not even being able to think logically.
c) trying to discredit any company (or person) that has ever made any product for a J and run then out of business,
This is continued by a know-it-all wanna-be's that are very ill informed, and really have NO idea what they are talking about. The problem is that they are upset by everybody siding with me, and congratulating me on helping them look like the fools they continue to make themselves out to be.
I am happy to say, none of this discourages me in the slightest from my passion.
My business and my hobby is too important to me to be so easily dissuaded by the feeble attempts of a few to make me feel/look bad. I am also happy to help out others in the 'community' and will continue to do so. When I continue to do so, my motivation will never be 'for the glory' but rather to simply help people.
There is plenty of quiet support for myself, as well as very vocal support. What will be, will be.
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